The full ring limit games are nowadays very hard?

[JussiUt]

I've recently played at Prima at 0.50/1 FL and although I enjoyed good success during my first 5k hands then I hit the downswing and suffered a lot of bad beats. However, I noticed also that the players there are at least good, many of them very good. Approximately 8 out of 10 players have VPIP about 20% or less and most of them are very agressive.

There's a reload now at Bet356 so it could be that it attracts a lot of good players now to Prima but still I'm somewhat baffled. The books I've read promised that there are a lot juicy games out there but what I've seen 0.50/1$ is supertight and filled with players who know all the fundamentals.

Basically I'm trying to say that maybe the games are just too hard for me nowadays. Full ring limit games are definately not the gold mine the books promised and what I expected. I'm sure there are money to be made at full ring limit games but still I don't understand people who claim that eg. Prima games are full of fish. Maybe they are geniouses or something but for a modestly advanced player like myself the games aren't that good.

Should I try no limit? Do you find more fish from there? What about shorthanded play, many say that that's the place where the money's made nowadays. Opinions, please. I've read books, studied my game and tried to tolerate variance but my faith has gone for me to crush these so called "easy micro-limit games".

[twoakers]

In my limited expereince I have had similar results. I had been led to believe that the micro's on Party were extremely fishy and loose. Although I did find very loose players, it seemed that, on a paritcularly loose table, there were only 2-3 per 10 person table. The others were all seeing flops in the 20% range. Some tables had a flops seen % of less than 20%. It confused me as well. I have since moved to playing NL sng's, so I haven't dealt with rings for around 6 weeks. My Party experience was in January.

[Hybrid_11]

I think the problem here, with many people is their quick to blame the games or the cards. Try posting hands in the micro limit section, see how they critique your play. your really not going to get anything out of posting what seems to be just a rant/whine. Work on your game, the games are still very beatable.

[mikeevans12]

I know what your talking about, I would not say the players are tuff, but just tighter than before. Make the switch to shorthanded, the maniacs and fish hang out there much more. Plus, it will significantly improve your full-ring play as well.

[smbruin22]

my limited experience is somewhat similar......

a few thoughts:

things have tightened up considerably. combination of "natural selection" (i.e. people who drop $300-$1000 a week habitually on poker eventually wise up, voluntarily or not), multi-tabling, pokertracker.

i think sites that don't work for poker tracking software and ones with sports books (and maybe sites with more europeans - sorry) are easier.

fish and maniacs have moved to shorthanded and no-limit, but i'd still be very careful of all the tight-aggressive multi-tablers out there.

i played canbet (reasonably soft) and i've heard pacific poker is pretty soft (but not like it was 2 years ago)

[jkd]

JussiUt,

I was sitting at some tables with you just yesterday I think. I've been playing on Prima on and off for a while, and if you can believe it, those are some of the juicier tables I've seen (a couple of >VP$30 tables)

Prima tables are tighter than average, but post-flop, things are still fairly fishy and weak-tight. You'll encounter more weak-tight bonus-whores than TAGs there. Also, you'll find alot of the same players, so you have much better reads.

Playing on Prima inspired me to learn more about how to beat tighter games. However, 6max games are pretty juicy there (VP$40-50). What is also nice is that they have 6max tables down to .05-/.10, so it's a good place to get your bearings.

Post some hands from those games you've been playing too.

Good luck,
jkd

[Commie]

On Pacific I often see the same kinds of people, under 20% VPIP and 5-10% PFR, with a nice AF too. The weird thing is that most of these people have lost a lot of $ in the long run from my stats (over several hundred hands).

I don't think that TAG necessarily leads to winning players, even though it's true most of the time.

[plonker]

[ QUOTE ]
On Pacific I often see the same kinds of people, under 20% VPIP and 5-10% PFR, with a nice AF too. The weird thing is that most of these people have lost a lot of $ in the long run from my stats (over several hundred hands).

I don't think that TAG necessarily leads to winning players, even though it's true most of the time.

[/ QUOTE ]

Over a few hundred hands [img]/images/graemlins/ooo.gif[/img]

Alot of 2 plus 2ers play more then that in a session. I've just come through a 90 BB downswing which lasted over 1K of hands.

TAG's do make money IN THE LONG RUN [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[Commie]

[ QUOTE ]

Over a few hundred hands [img]/images/graemlins/ooo.gif[/img]

Alot of 2 plus 2ers play more then that in a session. I've just come through a 90 BB downswing which lasted over 1K of hands.

TAG's do make money IN THE LONG RUN [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Lol yea I have to admit that's not much, but

1. I do have a select few whom I have in the 1000s of hands and they're still losing (yea yea it's possible but come on)

2. Downswings do happen, but the sheer # of TAG losers I have in my database is astounding.

3. I haven't been playing very long yet [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[retleftolc]

I think that the games are tougher in the sense that the players are tighter on average nowadays. The players are still bad postflop. I play full .5/1 and in the last 2 months Im at my best win rate ever. Running hot no doubt, but tight doesn't mean good.

Post hands in th micros and take the advice and use it. I have heard SH is the way to go these days, but I havent made the jump yet.

Ret