Long time no post

Dave Mac · #1 01-12-2006, 04:29 AM

haven't posted a hand in a while, been playing NL and some other games and played my first seesion of limit in about a month tonight.
It is UB 30-60 6 max currently 4 handed.

UTG folds, I raise on the Button with AdQs, Sb folds, BB calls. BB is a horrible lag, he has raised about 10 pots in a row, pf and then fired away, but has been winnning a lot of the hands and is on a mini heater.

Flop is 3d3h7d
He checks, I bet he c-rs, what is my plan for the hand.

My first instinct is that i prolly have the best hand, but i am not sure just calling each street is the best course, i thought about 3 betting the flop, and then checking any non-A or Q turn or raising the turn and checking any non-A or Q river. but i also don't want to give him the oppertunity to 3 bet me and get me off the better hand. so i am not sure what to do, also i don't want to just fold and have him try to cr me all the time and i am also not sure i what a call down does for me meta game. if i win i guess it will be good and if i lose i will look like a [censored] head.

i dunno just some thoughts, what do you guys think.
dave

elindauer · #2 01-12-2006, 09:11 AM

Hi Dave,

Against a LAG, I am showdown bound. Whether or not to raise depends on how laggy he is. You want to raise until the extra bets you put in calling down are done at a disadvantage to you.

What do I mean by this? Well, if you call down, you're putting in 2.5 more BB. Ok, no problem. You're the favorite on this board, you're happy to do it. What about raising the flop?

Well, if he raises again, you probably still have to call down. How do you feel about that extra BB you put in? Are you happy you went from 2.5 BB to 3.5 BB postflop? If you are, then raise. If not, then call.

Similar logic applies to decisions to raise unimproved on the turn.

Finally, if you do improve, you should probably play just like you did when you hadn't improved until at least the river. Let the LAG hold the lead and make money from his attempts to bluff you, then raise the river for value depending on the strength of your hand relative to his legitimate hand range.

-Eric

StacysMom · #3 01-12-2006, 01:05 PM

"Similar logic applies to decisions to raise unimproved on the turn."

In addition the turn raise may fold out a 6 outer.

DcifrThs · #4 01-12-2006, 01:28 PM

[ QUOTE ]
"Similar logic applies to decisions to raise unimproved on the turn."

In addition the turn raise may fold out a 6 outer.

[/ QUOTE ]

or may force you to pay 4 big bets to see a hand you may not be ahead of.

Barron

DcifrThs · #5 01-12-2006, 01:29 PM

if you choose to raise, you have to know pretty damn well that if you call down his reraise and future bets that you still have more than the requisite chance of being good.

in normal cases vs. normal players, if you raise and get 3bet on th eturn you're done, but ehre you can't be.

Barron

Josh. · #6 01-12-2006, 04:18 PM

[ QUOTE ]
"Similar logic applies to decisions to raise unimproved on the turn."

In addition the turn raise may fold out a 6 outer.

[/ QUOTE ]

you would rather he bluff the river than fold the turn to a raise. he will win a 5 BB pot 1/7 of the time with his 6 outer but give you 1 full BB on the river

poker1O1 · #7 01-12-2006, 07:41 PM

[ QUOTE ]
you would rather he bluff the river than fold the turn to a raise. he will win a 5 BB pot 1/7 of the time with his 6 outer but give you 1 full BB on the river

[/ QUOTE ]

Dave Mac · #8 01-13-2006, 12:12 AM

well he actully just check folded the flop and i won. however, i thought the spot was kinda interesting. i think/guess the best line really is jsut to call down, but that also kinda sucks. i feel like being decent poker players we should have a way to play this better not just call down like donks. but i really don't see any other way.
thanks for the replies.
dave

Schizo · #9 01-17-2006, 03:58 AM

[ QUOTE ]

you would rather he bluff the river than fold the turn to a raise. he will win a 5 BB pot 1/7 of the time with his 6 outer but give you 1 full BB on the river

[/ QUOTE ]

eh, not to be a nit, but if he's bluffing w/ a 6 outer on the turn he'll be good 1/6.33 times on the river.

Bad Lobster · #10 01-19-2006, 08:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
i feel like being decent poker players we should have a way to play this better not just call down like donks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sure, we do--use a little game theory. Given the current size of the pot and assuming the villain could have any two random cards at this point, what are the odds he's ahead right now and what mixture of raises, calls, and folds gives you the highest long-term expectation against his optimum strategy?

Admittedly, doing the actual math is a little bit complex.