Standard folds?

[Apanage]

This is not a not agreeing with you post Oink.I just chosed you to reply to in order to post.
If we assume that Stox is the high player in his book he is not raising 22 from Co more than about 1/3 of the time according to the hand-by hand chart.
The starting hand chart that is advocated does however contain 22 as an open raising hand.
But as said before the starting hand (OR) chart presented in the book does not correlate exactly to what the high player actually had played in his database.

If i remember it correctly during those 50 or so hands he had open raised he showed a minimal profit. And since he just played it 1/3 of the time he probably choosed the right spots to do it.
Taking into account rake issues and looser players that can´t lay down a pair I would very much doubt that 22 from CO is anywhere near being profitable in low-limits (below 5/10) except under very specific circumstances.
However I have no proof whatsoever for it.

I also think that Stox is a very good player but that there are lot of players at 2+2 that are as good as him or almost as good as him (I´m not one of them). Those players have just chosen to play 5/10 to 15/30 because that they have a different view of risk aversion.

[Robin Foolz]

hand1: he's very very passive. i would call and see if he checks his AQ-AK-KQ on the turn. i guess TT and 88 could check also, but his whiffed range is wider than those pps mentioned.

hand2: fine. pot small. folding here is completely fine as default.

if you want to sd here, you really need to have a read that this guy 2barrels and 3barrels with air a lot, or bets with worse hands like small pps a lot. and understand that sd here is gonna be high variance.

[TheHip41]

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why does everyone assume whatever stox does is law.

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I dont. But Stox has to my knowledge and as opposed to you presented empirical results which shows that 22 is +EV in CO.

That doesnt mean however that everyone reading SSSH should open with 22 in the CO 100%.

Nor does it mean that Stox results are actually correct since I am sure that the databases they use have an insufficient sample size to conclude anything in this matter.

All you have presented on this matter and other matters regarding preflop plays is claims made in your usual arrogant and dickish tone.

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i'm right here, i'm telling you raising 22 here is a losing play.


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Please present results with EV and variance, calculated t-values and probabilities that 22 is -EV in the CO.

If you cant please stop claiming that you know something you only think you know since claiming stuff you dont know is pretty useless and counterproductive.


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if you disagree, then please, continue to raise 22 in the CO.

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I will. Is it ok if I only raise it once in a while when I think its +EV?


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On other thing to consider, I usually play at tables where there is a lot of green.


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Congrats. So do I. But i am pretty sure that most readers dont give a [censored] about which stakes you play. However, most of us give a [censored] about arguments presented in a proper fashion using good reasoning and non-dickish tones.


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so raising here, and getting called in 2 places, and betting the flop and getting 2 guys to call with any pair, or both call with nothing, this is not a situation you want with 22.


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As we all know this is the only possible outcome of playing 22 in the CO.


PS. You are a nit
PPS. Have you considered the possibility that 22 is +EV for some but not for you?
PPPS. If I come as a jerk it is fully intended. IMO your posts are useless more often than not.

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my "green" comment was meant to be taken as this, I play with 4 fish and 1 pro and me. Lots of green, means high VPIP, low PFR, low aggression, not high stakes.

and yes, I can come off as a dick.

I know there are tons of players on AP better than me, that's why I avoid them.

I'm a 25/17/2

If I played at some horrible tables like the rest of the tags, I would have a chance to get my vpip and pfr up, but since 2 fish limp in, I can't raise A3o on the button.

The point is, I'm a good player, but not the best. For me, raising 22 here is burning money.

If I'm losing money, the people with less experience will too.

If you can play this hand profitably from the CO, then do it, but most people here aren't as good as you.

My post provide westley/ilp entertainment, and he has asked me not to stop, so I cannot.

[johnnylovescandy]

+EV,-EV,stox,stats,etc...who cares???
Pound those douches into this guys face in hand 1 & make him fold his ace.
Is it coincidence you played your douches like a pussy???

[deviouz]

pocket deuces is a very marginal hand, I think you can play it from the button sometimes with many players in, and just limp it, but you should usually fold it, the reason it's just not profitable from any other position, I wouldnt even try to steal the blinds with it if folded to me on the bt, you are certanly right to fold there. A7s is a good hand to defend with, but you have a clear fold on the flop

[chesspain]

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lmao at open raising 22 in the CO, have fun with that one.

against retardo that are 77/20+ and I have a note they 3barrel i'm never folding that 7, ever

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