Everything we've always wanted to ask about NL thread...

[MrWookie]

Typically, the 50 in 50 NL refers to the size of the usual max buy-in: 100 BB when the blinds are 0.25 and 0.50. If someone says 3/6 NL, that means 600 NL.

[daveymck]

Its the land of milk and honey more for the better game selection and being the in game for the donks rather than any difference in earning/variance potential imho. It may be someone can come up with figures otherwise but the key is still to multitable to get you hourly rate up.

As for comparisons of limits I think it pointless trying to compare because your own NL skill has a lot to do with difficulty, when I moved from limit to NL I went from playing 3/ 5/10 to $25NL and would suggest initially most people do too, even if its for a few thousand hands before moving up quickly.

There are fundamental adjustments to make when moving over the biggest I think is adjusting your play on tptk and overpair hands, as well as the even more huge importance of position in NL. Working this out at the lower limits first will make your transition a cheaper experience.

As well as whatever reading I think watching some of the cardrunner videos (especially the early ones) will be of great benefit to anyone moving over.

[Surf]

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What are the comparable limits between the two? Like is 100NL roughly like 3/6 limit?


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Yeah, can anyone answer this in the 'relative degree of difficulty and how donkish the donks are' sense? I find this interesting.

Surely 3/6 LHE is more difficult than NL100 (in that sense)?


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In general 3/6 lhe is going to be roughly equivalent to NL100 or NL50 depending on average game toughness differences etc.
NL = Limit
2/4 = 10/20
3/6 = 15/30 or 20/40
5/10 = 20/40 or 30/60 depending on how deep it plays
10/20 = 50/100ish

As another player mentioned, live games will often play deeper than they look. I was in a 10/20NL game last weekend that played huge, i had a 3k stack and was the 3rd smallest at the table - over half the table had 8-10k in front of them, and they weren't afraid to use it - I saw 5 pots over 7k in the first hour and a half.

Back on track...
For example the FT 5/10 lhe game is tougher than many 5/10s in years gone by, but it can still be really good, but I would say that in general 100nl is easier to beat than 5/10 lhe, given similar skill levels.

The FT 2/4 nl is pretty competitive (lots of tags, though many don't play good postflop) and reminds me of party 10/20 limit from about a year ago(just before MONSTER), where you had to be pretty competent postflop to stay ahead of the rake b/c you weren't sitting at tables with 4 fish, it was like 2-4 lagtags, you, and 1-3 fish. It's still a super-profitable game if you're competent, especially because you can bazillion-table.

With that said it's still all about game selection. Make sure you are sitting in a game with 1-2 obvious fish (preferably on your right, if they are passive postflop on your left is fine) and you'll do fine with solid fundamentals.

Surf

[Surf]

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when I moved from limit to NL I went from playing 3/6 5/10 to $25NL and would suggest initially most people do too, even if its for a few thousand hands before moving up quickly.

There are fundamental adjustments to make when moving over the biggest I think is adjusting your play on tptk and overpair hands, as well as the even more huge importance of position in NL. Working this out at the lower limits first will make your transition a cheaper experience.


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This is a really good point. you WILL donk off 3-5 BIs as you learn how to change the value of hands and figure out how your opponent's ranges are different. Starting at a lower limit makes this cost of learning much lower.

I provided a comparison of limits between the two games just for a frame of reference so players could know how to think about game size. I was jumping straight into 5/10nl when i first switched (without being ready at all!) because i thought it wasn't that big a game.

If you play 10/20 limit, don't dive into 2/4 without some extensive prep time: studying, getting coaching, watching videos, whatever. Definitely take a couple thousand hands at 25nl or 50nl just to get your feet wet and get those couple first "oops, just got stacked with AA vs a set" and "he's raising but i've got TPTK, this is great!" mistakes out of the way. You'll move up quickly as you become comfortable with the game.

Surf

[Victor]

i kinda disagree with moving down to 25 or 50. i suppose it depends on your bankroll but if youve been playing 10-20 for awhile i dont see why you cant jump into 1-2 or 2-4 games and "pay" for your experience.

further, i dont think you will automatically donk off buyins. play like a nit postflop. most important rule of nl.

[Surf]

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further, i dont think you will automatically donk off buyins. play like a nit postflop. most important rule of nl.

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There's almost certainly a grace period where a transitioning player will make mistakes. There is no need to spew with an overpair, but it is important to take some time to experiment with calldowns just to see how your opponents play different types of hands, and what different lines mean. This is cheaper, lower, even if it's 100nl instead of 400nl.

I agree w/ the "play like a nit postflop" idea for those just switching over. Assume everyone is else is a nit too(about getting 100bb in the middle - if a guy is OOP and c/r flop, pot turn, he probably can beat 1 pair or he's pure bluffing /semibluffing) until proven otherwise.

Surf

[diebitter]

If you want to start low, I'd advocate nl50 as your absolute minimum. That's the point it plays like the proper game. nl25 and below is pretty retarded.

[kaby]

Meh I haven't seen much differnece between nl25 and nl50

[sethypooh21]

In my experience the general level of play is pretty wretched at NL100 (many villains stacking off with AJ to a pf3better on an AKx board, etc...)

[Victor]

" take some time to experiment with calldowns just to see how your opponents play different types of hands, and what different lines mean. This is cheaper, lower, even if it's 100nl instead of 400nl."

isnt there a difference between hand values and calldowns at 50 and 400? part of the reason i jumped right into 2/4 was bc i didnt want to learn low and then have to relearn later.