Multi Way two pair(NL50)

[21SuicideKing21]

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Got to bet the turn, $12 + $17

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River you have to pay off A10, no way he slowplays AJ that much with that many players in the pot.

[jimpo]

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From NLHTAP:


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Others may disagree, but I have found NLHTAP pretty confusing/downright bad for uNL games with 100bb stacks. It seems more geared towards deep live NL games with at least somewhat skilled villains who need to be tricked into mistakes. I feel like I am hurting my game more than helping it when I read the book.

As for the hand, I would be surprised to see someone slowplay flop against so many opponents on a drawy board, so I am not fearing a set / top two that much on the turn.

[eigenvalue]

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minraising drawing hands = bad. do you need us to explain why?

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You are in deep trouble and your preflop game sucks.

[Sweir]

Like everyone else I hate pf. My standard play here is to fold pf, but if I am running over the table and they are giving me way too much respect etc. then I don't mind raising it up to $2. As played pot flop and turn.

Also if you are having trouble playing postflop then tighten up preflop so your decisions will be made easier. Also stick to standard raise.

[C4LL4W4Y]

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I don't think anyone posting in microstakes has the credentials to challange Sklansky.

To get back on topic I'll post the remainder of the hand.

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On the contrary, I don't think Skalansky writes that much information relevant to the internet uNL games being played over the last three-four months.

[evazan]

One last point about pf min raise. I said before it is a very rare play that I make and I agree with Sklansky that there is nothing inherently bad about it as long as you are comfortable with your post flop play.

The main thing which made this hand tricky for me was having 3 people call my flop bet, something which doesn't happen that often. This is why I believe the major error I made in the hand was not potting the flop, rather then min raising pre. I will however take into account some of the negatives people brought up about the min-raise even though not too many people gave examples. Most just said "Don't min raise PF" without a reason why.

Results:

I called and villain showed down A9o. I used the same logic as everyone else and figured villain wouldn't have slow played AJ or set two streets multiway on a two flush board. The main hand I was scared of was A10 but in that case I would have had to pay him off.

[kurto]

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The main thing which made this hand tricky for me was having 3 people call my flop bet, something which doesn't happen that often.

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??? When you minraise, don't you encourage people to call with all kinds of hands?

I'm more curious about your reason for minraising. I raise minraisers quite often because I treat it like a limp and I want to isolate.

I'm not completely opposed to a minraise. I just don't understand why you would do it with this hand in this position. I understand the concept of a pot sweetener but I don't see why this hand is one you want to do that with. You're rarely going to hit a flop as strong as this. You'll flop draws a lot which you'll be in the unfortunate position of playing it out of position.

Regarding the rest of the play- I like that you induced a bluff. Nice play.

[evazan]

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The main thing which made this hand tricky for me was having 3 people call my flop bet, something which doesn't happen that often.

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??? When you minraise, don't you encourage people to call with all kinds of hands?

I'm more curious about your reason for minraising. I raise minraisers quite often because I treat it like a limp and I want to isolate.

I'm not completely opposed to a minraise. I just don't understand why you would do it with this hand in this position. I understand the concept of a pot sweetener but I don't see why this hand is one you want to do that with. You're rarely going to hit a flop as strong as this. You'll flop draws a lot which you'll be in the unfortunate position of playing it out of position.

Regarding the rest of the play- I like that you induced a bluff. Nice play.

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I min raised encouraging people to call preflop but it is still uncommon to then have everyone call a 2/3 pot bet on that flop. OOP I should have bet the full pot and it would have made the rest of the hand easier to play.

I find that sometimes opening with a min raise can be a good way of seeing a cheap flop but this is entirely dependent of the table. At this particular table people were not three betting light and was pretty confident that I this move would generate a multi-way pot that was slightly built up. Just limping here is not an option as someone will most likely make a real raise and I'll have to fold. My usual play is either folding or betting around 1.5-2.

I didn't used to make this play before reading NLHTAP but after I read that I learned some of the advantages it could have. I don't recommend doing it frequently but in the right spot I believe it can be +EV.