did I misplay this hand - QJs

[MrBlah]

[ QUOTE ]
so betting the turn is pointless

[/ QUOTE ]
I've been thinking about this a lot lately. Wouldn't you raise the turn for value as you had a lot of equity? With 13BB in the pot you wouldn't even mind an improbable turn check raise.

[milesdyson]

we have at most 8 outs on the turn. this means we are 4.75:1 to hit the nuts on the river.

if UTG bet and the other 4 players called, you may mistakenly think you are getting 5:1 on a raise. sometimes you will be, but many times UTG will 3-bet and/or someone will fold, making your equity edge drop.

even if you do get all the callers, you make everyone more likely to just check call the river when you do hit. if you just call you have a better chance of getting two bets in on the river when you do improve.

summary:

1. your equity edge is tiny and betting/raising will likely ruin it.
2. you reduce your implied odds by telling them they should just check call the river.

[basco]

grunch

I don't raise this pf. It's too easily dominated. That said, it's a definite call, and the raise is probably close.

Flop raise is good. On the turn, I ALWAYS take that free card - too many callers so there's no way you have more than your share of equity with 7 outs or so.

River is standard. I think it's a rare situation where you don't raise the nuts in favor of an overcall.

[milesdyson]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't raise this pf. It's too easily dominated

[/ QUOTE ]
you'd be surprised. AQ KQ AJ KJ. that's it man, and some of these will be raised preflop. this is a huge value raise.

people should be raising JTs here as a default. like you should be able to play postflop just a tad better than average and still definitely profit from raising JTs here.

[Xhad]

[ QUOTE ]
Wouldn't you raise the turn for value as you had a lot of equity?

[/ QUOTE ]

Your equity: about 17%
Your share in the pot: About 16.6% if everyone calls

Your straight will come in a little under 1/5 of the time. You need all five people to call for a value bet to be marginally profitable (by like .04BB), and even against loose fish someone will often fold here.

[ QUOTE ]
With 13BB in the pot you wouldn't even mind an improbable turn check raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

-It's not that improbable. Given the action so far this is the perfect spot for a K to c/r the turn.
-While a c/r doesn't knock you off your hand, it is kind of pointless to blow 2BB on an underdog when you could have made your draw for free, considering how small an edge you were pushing to begin with.

[AcidJazz]

Bah you made your straight woops... Everything I said before just goes to show how much more experience I need in this game =)

I did say I didn't think you really lost anything by checking the turn but you might have weeded out the possible pair / two pair that could have potentially had you beat. The pot was huge and a chance to get anybody out of the pot might have been good but free cards are always nice too =)

[medaugh]

I was going to say to wait and raise the turn, but got thinking that they might check it thru.... I raise the flop as well. Bet the turn with this line. You have 6 clean out and the 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] outs as well.

NH

[milesdyson]

[ QUOTE ]
I was going to say to wait and raise the turn, but got thinking that they might check it thru.... I raise the flop as well. Bet the turn with this line. You have 6 clean out and the 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] outs as well.

NH

[/ QUOTE ]
wow did you even read the thread?

[billymonk]

Perfect from start to finish.

[ltb]

grunching..

this all looks good to me. i like taking the free card on the turn.