AJo from BB Short Handed - pf play

[Absolution]

You don't have a hand that has to worry about scaring off customers. In fact, never worry about scaring off customers pre-flop. Push your edges pre-flop and generally post-flop as well (there are exceptions post-flop where you call to encourage others to come.)

This is a hand that has good equity against those in the pot. One guy posted so he has any 2 (and actually it's more likely he has a worse hand since he would probably raise any good ones he picked up.) You should raise this pre-flop because you have a good equity edge and nobody is going to fold for one more bet. Passive players don't fold for 1 more bet.

The river is an obvious bet as you already seem to know, but look how much bigger the pot would be if you raised pre-flop.

[n1_pete]

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You don't have a hand that has to worry about scaring off customers. In fact, never worry about scaring off customers pre-flop. Push your edges pre-flop and generally post-flop as well (there are exceptions post-flop where you call to encourage others to come.)

This is a hand that has good equity against those in the pot. One guy posted so he has any 2 (and actually it's more likely he has a worse hand since he would probably raise any good ones he picked up.) You should raise this pre-flop because you have a good equity edge and nobody is going to fold for one more bet. Passive players don't fold for 1 more bet.

The river is an obvious bet as you already seem to know, but look how much bigger the pot would be if you raised pre-flop.

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most constructive feedback ever [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] thanks Ab

[bozlax]

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# pf bothers me. at the time given passive nature of table i was worried bet from BB would scare off players.

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Why are you worried about this? In other words, a) why do you raise AJo preflop from the BB, and b) why would everybody folding when you raised preflop be a problem with respect to the answer?

As to the rest of the hand, if everybody folding is your concern, why in the name of Shania would you open on an ace-high flop? What's your plan if c/r'd on the flop? On the turn when the flush comes in? Why are you wondering what to do on the river (even tho it's obvious that you bet)?

[smacks forehead]

ZOMG...you won the hand! Have you met my friend BBV? Seriously, don't make up "questions" about a hand, just so you can make a brag post like this.

[Smurph64]

Because of the flush board I thought this was a joke to prove that not raising AJ was correct because of his bet/fold line on the turn.

I thought he was posting a hand so blatantly bad that it was a learning tool of what not to think for others to look at.

It's scary to think he was being serious here.

[n1_pete]

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ZOMG...you won the hand! Have you met my friend BBV? Seriously, don't make up "questions" about a hand, just so you can make a brag post like this.

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made up? are you joking? posted a badly played hand, knowing it was badly played. but look above my avatar? see? 'journeyman' = a post above 'newb'. what the [censored] is wrong with asking a legitimate question about a hand i knew i played badly but don't fully understand why it's so bad? if i'd posted 1000 times here, then fair enough it's the most stupid question ever. but when you're just getting your head around concepts like equity edge, uncomfortable at a half empty table, etc what exactly is wrong with this post when my intention is to learn and progress?? thanks to constructive feedback from others here, i now know exactly how to play this and why.

as a wise man said, don't [censored] on the little man, he might just punch you up the ass!!

[bozlax]

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made up? are you joking?

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Uh, yeah, a little. Lighten up.

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i now know exactly how to play this and why

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I doubt that. This is one hand, and chances are you'll not run across this particular scenario for another 100k repetitions. Think in generalities.

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as a wise man said, don't [censored] on the little man, he might just punch you up the ass!!

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I notice you didn't answer any of my questions, Socratically designed to help you answer the question yourself. Why's that? Too busy being offended?

[Sushiglutton]

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Push your edges pre-flop and generally post-flop as well (there are exceptions post-flop where you call to encourage others to come.)

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You are making things way too easy for urself. There are a lot of hands that have an edge here that I suspect u don't raise such as A5o, 22 QTo, etc. I guess you allready know all the arguments for keeping the pot small agaist loose opps OOP with a RIO hand.
I totally agree there is an edge to push. The interesting question is: where is the 'break-even hand' between pf-edge and post-flop disadvantage? For me it's AQo agaisnt 3 loose opps OOP (assumng the are loose post flop. If they are tight raising becomes much better. Also if we somehow knew the guy who posted is tight I like a raise).

I have not come to the conclusion AQo by some deep mathematical thinking, but it seems ok to me. I don't claim that's correct. If you have some analysis proving AJo should be raised I would be interested

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look how much bigger the pot would be if you raised pre-flop.

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This is awfully result oriented.

[n1_pete]

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made up? are you joking?

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Uh, yeah, a little. Lighten up.

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i now know exactly how to play this and why

[/ QUOTE ]

I doubt that. This is one hand, and chances are you'll not run across this particular scenario for another 100k repetitions. Think in generalities.

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as a wise man said, don't [censored] on the little man, he might just punch you up the ass!!

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I notice you didn't answer any of my questions, Socratically designed to help you answer the question yourself. Why's that? Too busy being offended?

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ok. point taken. what do I know? absolutely nothing. you're right i may have just gone a bit over the top there.

[Absolution]

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Push your edges pre-flop and generally post-flop as well (there are exceptions post-flop where you call to encourage others to come.)

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You are making things way too easy for urself. There are a lot of hands that have an edge here that I suspect u don't raise such as A5o, 22 QTo, etc. I guess you allready know all the arguments for keeping the pot small agaist loose opps OOP with a RIO hand.
I totally agree there is an edge to push. The interesting question is: where is the 'break-even hand' between pf-edge and post-flop disadvantage? For me it's AQo agaisnt 3 loose opps OOP (assumng the are loose post flop. If they are tight raising becomes much better. Also if we somehow knew the guy who posted is tight I like a raise).

I have not come to the conclusion AQo by some deep mathematical thinking, but it seems ok to me. I don't claim that's correct. If you have some analysis proving AJo should be raised I would be interested

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look how much bigger the pot would be if you raised pre-flop.

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This is awfully result oriented.

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Um, of course it's results oriented and being results oriented isn't automatically a bad thing. He had a LARGE equity edge pre-flop that he should have pushed. If he had of pushed that edge early he would have won a bigger pot when he hit a good board like this. If he had a smaller edge, (a hand like A8o) he could of course check pre-flop, but for me the equity edge with this hand is sufficient pre-flop to push it there. We push equity edges pre-flop so that we can build bigger pots to win.

[Sushiglutton]

As a rule of thumb: how much equit do you need in this spot to push it?