Fold on flop ? turn ?

[danzasmack]

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Meh, I play it the same. Also, I raise QJo utg with some regularity, though I probably wouldn't at 1/2 where something like A6o is likely to cold call in the HJ.

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QJo, KTo, QTo, KJo, all losers UTG in tough 6max games.

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That doesn't matter

what matters is what is higher

your winrate UTG w/those hands as part of your range or your winrate UTG w/o those hands as part of your range

[secretprankster]

Queen jack is awesome. It hits like every flop in some way. Can't fold a hand like that.

[Oink]

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Meh, I play it the same. Also, I raise QJo utg with some regularity, though I probably wouldn't at 1/2 where something like A6o is likely to cold call in the HJ.

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QJo, KTo, QTo, KJo, all losers UTG in tough 6max games.

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Proof please.

[TheHip41]

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Meh, I play it the same. Also, I raise QJo utg with some regularity, though I probably wouldn't at 1/2 where something like A6o is likely to cold call in the HJ.

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QJo, KTo, QTo, KJo, all losers UTG in tough 6max games.

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Proof please.

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read stox's book

no one is turning a profit with KTo, and KJo is about breakeven. All it does is make your swings bigger.

if you don't believe me, thats fine, I'm just saying, utg, i have cut all this crap out of my open raising range.

I raise KJo in the HJ now, and KTo in the cutoff, QJo in the cutoff as well

[Oink]

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Meh, I play it the same. Also, I raise QJo utg with some regularity, though I probably wouldn't at 1/2 where something like A6o is likely to cold call in the HJ.

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QJo, KTo, QTo, KJo, all losers UTG in tough 6max games.

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Proof please.

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read stox's book

no one is turning a profit with KTo, and KJo is about breakeven. All it does is make your swings bigger.

if you don't believe me, thats fine, I'm just saying, utg, i have cut all this crap out of my open raising range.

I raise KJo in the HJ now, and KTo in the cutoff, QJo in the cutoff as well

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[img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I do believe you. I just hate absolute "here is the non debateable truth" preflop advice.

2 nitpicking things tho

- Danza has a point
- The DB's in Stox book are not really proof. Far from enough hands to prove they are loosers.

[sethypooh21]

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Meh, I play it the same. Also, I raise QJo utg with some regularity, though I probably wouldn't at 1/2 where something like A6o is likely to cold call in the HJ.

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QJo, KTo, QTo, KJo, all losers UTG in tough 6max games.

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I'm a modest winner with QJo/KJo UTG (I've stopped playing KTo UTG, FWIW) plus I don't play in 'tough' 6max games at present. Game selection FTW...

[mvoss]

For me it's a fold preflop. Other than that I think you can fold the river.

[TheHip41]

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Meh, I play it the same. Also, I raise QJo utg with some regularity, though I probably wouldn't at 1/2 where something like A6o is likely to cold call in the HJ.

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QJo, KTo, QTo, KJo, all losers UTG in tough 6max games.

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I'm a modest winner with QJo/KJo UTG (I've stopped playing KTo UTG, FWIW) plus I don't play in 'tough' 6max games at present. Game selection FTW...

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ok, say you have great game selection.

that means there are 2 players playing 50% of their hands, and when you are UTG, 1 of them is going to be in the blinds.

So raising QJo is going to put you in a four way bloated pot with trash.

Having good game selection is another reason I don't raise this PF

[sethypooh21]

You're right and my demonstrated results are wrong. Thank you for demonstrating my error.

(in all seriousness, I think QJo UTG itself is nearly neutral EV for me and almost certainly positive Shania for all those times I get to raise/cap AA/KK UTG)

[mute]

I raise QJ but not KT UTG. Does that make sense? I dont know really, but I think it's probably close enough, that it really doesn't matter.