routine?

[limon]

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can you really put him on 78 or 9t? a cc w/ 78 is highly unlikely and then not raising the flop w/ said 78 even makes it less likely he holds that hand. 9t is a lttle more likely if your grasping at strwas but even then if you run the numbers at poker stove and give him either 9t OR 87 in his range w/ 22.33.77.and 88 its still an easy fold. i think overpairs are out for the 4 bet..they MIGHT call 3 but not make it 4.

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I don't think T9 is necessarily likely, but possible. What I was trying to get at is that I think your perceived hand range and his actual hand range are two different things.

Basically, The Llama said everything I was going to say. Granted, I've never played 75/150, but even at 50/100, no one ever believes anyone. I don't think your expectation of this guy folding his overpair on the turn after getting the excessive action that he was hoping for with his PF/flop line is going to happen, but maybe it's my hand range that's off.

Ultimately, I think AA is best/has outs often enough to not only see the river, but also a showdown.

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fold overpair rarely. 4 bet weak overpair even rarer.

[Victor]

folding to the 4 should never be an option. the 3bet is def debatable.

"..im no limit pro..."

lol

[stinkypete]

i'd love to go on a rant about how bad NL players are at limit hold'em, but i'll just quote cts since he explained it perfectly in his blog:

"The past few days I've been donking around in the 100/200 limit hold'em games, which I haven't played forever. It's a nice change of pace and I feel like NLHE players do pretty well because they read hands better than some LHE players who just call down every time no matter how obvious it is they are beat..."

[limon]

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folding to the 4 should never be an option. the 3bet is def debatable.

"..im no limit pro..."

lol

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wow...so on a dry board you never fold aces on the turn...ever. thats new. is this just on line or live as well?

[limon]

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i'd love to go on a rant about how bad NL players are at limit hold'em, but i'll just quote cts since he explained it perfectly in his blog:

"The past few days I've been donking around in the 100/200 limit hold'em games, which I haven't played forever. It's a nice change of pace and I feel like NLHE players do pretty well because they read hands better than some LHE players who just call down every time no matter how obvious it is they are beat..."

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i tend to agree w/cts there..please, start rant...now

[stinkypete]

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i tend to agree w/cts there

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i know. you are a no limit player.

[limon]

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i tend to agree w/cts there

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i know. you are a no limit player.

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i actually play a ton of limit, just not limit holdem. the mixed game is almost always limit. im not saying im right on the subject at hand but i think my analysis is still best.

[Victor]

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folding to the 4 should never be an option. the 3bet is def debatable.

"..im no limit pro..."

lol

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wow...so on a dry board you never fold aces on the turn...ever. thats new. is this just on line or live as well?

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live i can find a fold to a single raise on the turn against plenty of players. none of them are considered lags, or aggro, or unpredictable.

online never and esp against a dude who is "button w/ semi lag stats."

[Smarty]

When I'm playing really really well I will fold here to the 4-bet, because you are almost always crushed here, and when the board does pair, a good chunk of the time you are still behind to a boat instead of ahead of a counterfeited 2-pair. Most of the time, however, I do call down and do lose.

[The Funky Llama]

if his range is only 22,33,77,88, 87s you have 6.5% equity with AA and are getting 10.5:1 to make the turn call which means you need 8.9% equity. So even if this is his range it is very close to a call.

Any player described as a lag online has a much bigger range however. He will often turn up with hands like 9To, K8s, and A8o here. A lot of times he is making a "free showdown cap," so your effective odds to call are better than they appear.

As for NL players playing limit, my experience is a lot different. A lot of times they may have better hand reading "skills", but the problem is they haven't played enough limit holdem to accurately put players on hand ranges based on their actions. It takes a ton of hands before you know how typical lags play hands in certain situations for example.

NL players also often tend to rely on their "reads" and often disregard the pot odds they are getting. This leads them to make bad folds fairly often.

And don't get me started on river value betting...