AK hand again

[Point Blank]

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Ok what if i played your line and villain now checks the river and the middle player bets and i have to worry about the over caller?

p.s. i still dont get why alot of seansoned peeps are mentioning that someone with such a low AF could actually be an agro player? (again, not just this post)

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AF is relative to vpip ... an AF of 1.0 does not carry the same meaning for all vpip ...

a player with vpip of 15 and an af of 1 is passive ... a player with 60 and 1 is not passive

AF is bet/call ... the player with 60 is getting many more chances to play
if he bets 45% of all flops he is betting think about how many crappy hands he is betting vs a player how sees 15% of flop (and bets 75% of them)

You should start looking at the 'aggression frequency' stat more often to understand how AF relates to VPIP

also ... 30hands to not enough to judge any player

... on the hand,
why do you want to bet the turn?

also, if the first guy checks on the river and the middle guy bets I'll fold

I don't think betting the turn is a bad option - but after betting this flop and getting two callers, I'll assume that one may have a pair (more times not ... though, a lot of the times both will be 'taking one off' - and the Queen is a good scare card ... so bet or check is probably about even maybe)

[bozlax]

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Oh i agree completely but dont stats have some reflection of how he plays? I mean if that wasnt the case then whats the purpose of having stats... I dont get you you can go about saying someone who has xx/15/.84 is an agro postflop? I mean so many ppl are just assuming that.. It makes no logical sense to me.

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Point_Blank covered most of it, but an important point to emphasize is this: PAF is not as indicative of a style of play as VPIP and PFR because PAF is related to something that Villan DIDN'T do (call postflop) not something he DID do (play a hand or raise a hand preflop, respectively). Also, because of this, PAF takes MUCH longer to converge to a meaningful number.

[Poker Gestalt]

Oh ok, makes alot more sense to me now. At what point (# of hands) does it start to kick in? Also, is agro frequency a better stat to keep up as an indication?

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Oh ok, makes alot more sense to me now. At what point (# of hands) does it start to kick in? Also, is agro frequency a better stat to keep up as an indication?

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I start to give consideration after 100 or so, I think after 500 the big stats start to converge (of course, noting what villian shows down and how he played that hand should be the biggest indicator of play style)

aggro frequency isn't 'better' - just another tool to use

[Poker Gestalt]

i guess i didnt really mean better but rather "a more accurate indication" but yeah you are right

[kerowo]

Some things to keep in mind while waiting for these stats to converge is to keep track of what he does; what he 3-bets with, what he caps with, if he won't fold any ace, or an under pp, if he 3-bets a hand then folds on the flop if you have capped and led out. Stuff like that.