confused with Kings. (Bell 30/60)

[Joe Tall]

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Since when do opponents muck the river after you check/call them?

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They do. Happened once in that session and 3 times in the past month or two despite my limited live play.

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Some guy named Tommy taught me how to get them to do it more than I ever thought was possible.

[CardSharpCook]

share?

[Caldarooni]

I dont know what Joe is talking about, but this guy Angelo helped me create an atmosphere of fear.

[BenA]

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share?

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Yes, please. Do you really think this will happen in this hand though? Unless of course he 5-bet preflop with something absurd...

[BobbyArmani]

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I raise kings, and a conservative-looking Asain gentleman to my left 3-bets. Folded back to me, so I 4-bet. He 5-bets. There is no cap HU. I call.

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FWIW,

I believe the rule in this room is bet and four raises on any street that is multiway. Only streets that begin HU are no limit.

The rule is not universally understood by the dealers and is inconsistently enforced.

[*TT*]

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I know I've butchered this hand, but I'd love to hear some thoughts.

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My only thought is that you played the hand well, I guess this hand is a good example of where the counterintuitive is probably the best course of action, keep the aggression at a minimum. You adjusted to your limited observation that your opponent has got a monster on the flop and is trying to suck you in but fortunately your showdown bound. The turn c/r isn't folding out any slow played A(ces) and you also don't want your opponent to fold thinking he is crushed in the event he has QQ/JJ (KK is unlikely for obvious reasons), hence check-call is nice.

I am torn between a bet/call and a check/call on the river, but I'd probably check-call to stick with the plan against AA (which a 5 bet is more likely to be in Vegas) and in the event trip Kings are good the meta value is more valuable than the extra bet gained.

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

[*TT*]

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Since when do opponents muck the river after you check/call them?

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All the time! Often you know in advance who is capable of this move, just find the habitual river bluffers when the board pairs, straights, or 3/4 flushes.

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[Bill King]

is there anything wrong with just betting the river?

if he has AK he'll probably do the raise for you.. if he does indeed have QQ-JJ he will just go ahead and check through or even fold to a bet.

does anybody like the frequncy of betting over checking for the mere hope that he does have AK vs checking through and letting QQ-JJ get a free showdown?

[Bill King]

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Since when do opponents muck the river after you check/call them?

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All the time! Often you know in advance who is capable of this move, just find the habitual river bluffers when the board pairs, straights, or 3/4 flushes.

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

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agreed.

i just dont think this is the right spot for that considering he showed such preflop agression.

but still, i see it all the time, and its definitly one of the most important things you can note in somebody's play, whether or not they'll make moves, because believe it or not a lot of players NEVER bluff. it's a lot more than some think.

[*TT*]

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is there anything wrong with just betting the river?

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2 reasons:

1) LAS VEGAS.

2) Meta value.

but if you do bet the river, its not horrible. But I would sure hate to have to call a raise with a significant dog against AA.

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