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#11
08-12-2006, 12:44 AM
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Re: Should I have said something
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] 1. Yes. Welcome to live poker. 2-3. Should effectively result in the same outcome, since the ruling should be that your hand is dead. You might get the option to act if you say something before his hand is mucked, but once his hand is mucked, your hand should be dead. [/ QUOTE ] Maybe I'm just not understanding it correctly, but why should heros hand be dead if it's villain that made the mistake? And theoretically, wouldn't that mean I can throw in a raise in a pot, then muck very fast before everyone's acted, thus their hands are dead? Sorry if I misunderstood wrong btw. [/ QUOTE ] If you try mucking before everyone acted, good luck with that. As soon as you muck you are out of the hand. The difference here is that someone hadn't acted, took a little too long to speak up and the raiser mucked despite a warning. So OP, what was the decision? 
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#12
08-12-2006, 01:30 AM
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Re: Should I have said something
It is every player's duty to uphold the integrity of the game. As such, OP's duty is to speak out, sometimes vociferously, when others act out of turn. Anything else is an angle shoot, and the TD should discern this from dealer's and player's comments after the fact.
So what happened?
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#13
08-12-2006, 01:35 AM
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Re: Should I have said something
ive played alot of live poker and seen people act out of turn quite a few times. its never even come close to having someone's hand in front of the mucker's hand declared dead.
Could not the other players just start mucking out of turn to get your hand declared dead?
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#14
08-12-2006, 01:53 AM
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Re: Should I have said something
[ QUOTE ]
Could not the other players just start mucking out of turn to get your hand declared dead? [/ QUOTE ] I guess if they were colluding and thought that you were a total [carebear].
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#15
08-12-2006, 01:59 AM
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Re: Should I have said something
[ QUOTE ]
ive played alot of live poker and seen people act out of turn quite a few times. its never even come close to having someone's hand in front of the mucker's hand declared dead. Could not the other players just start mucking out of turn to get your hand declared dead? [/ QUOTE ] The point is, if someone acts out of turn, it's your obligation to speak up and point out the action is still on you, before more players start acting out of turn. If the guy keeps acting out of turn repeatedly, he's going to be the one getting the warning.
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#16
08-12-2006, 01:53 PM
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Re: Should I have said something
[ QUOTE ]
ive played alot of live poker and seen people act out of turn quite a few times. its never even come close to having someone's hand in front of the mucker's hand declared dead. Could not the other players just start mucking out of turn to get your hand declared dead? [/ QUOTE ] Blind....raise Limper1...fold Limper2...fold HERO......hmmmmmm Limper3....fold Limper4....fold Limper5....fold Limper6....fold Hero.....hmmmmmm BB pushes cards toward dealer Hero.....hmmmmmm Dealer mucks BB's hand Hero....WAIT!!!!!! Floor....hmmmmmm, your hand is dead sir.
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#17
08-12-2006, 03:48 PM
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Re: Should I have said something
Like DN said, there were so many n00bs in the WSOP, even the dealers. People should pay attention. I would have gotten pissed because now that they have folded it might give away a tell. I would contact the person who's in charge. After his hand was mucked, I think a -fair- way would be to give yourself the limp back.
If you were really tricky, I would have gotten pissed while it was mucked and said I had AK/QQ.
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#19
08-13-2006, 02:31 PM
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Re: Should I have said something
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] 1. Yes. Welcome to live poker. 2-3. Should effectively result in the same outcome, since the ruling should be that your hand is dead. You might get the option to act if you say something before his hand is mucked, but once his hand is mucked, your hand should be dead. [/ QUOTE ] Maybe I'm just not understanding it correctly, but why should heros hand be dead if it's villain that made the mistake? And theoretically, wouldn't that mean I can throw in a raise in a pot, then muck very fast before everyone's acted, thus their hands are dead? Sorry if I misunderstood wrong btw. [/ QUOTE ] The villian didn't make the mistake. The dealer did.
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#20
08-13-2006, 03:06 PM
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Re: Should I have said something
The simple fact is, that this could go either way.
Someone has already pointed out that you are supposed to protect your action. When there has been substantial action behind you *like an entire table mucking* your hand can quite possibly be declared dead...you have had plenty of time to act on it before that occurs. I'm not 100% on this, just trying to parrot what I learned in dealer's school...however I can email two ladies who helped write the TDA rules to get a confirmation on this.
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