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#12
08-05-2006, 10:02 AM
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Re: 55 hand...*shakes head* capped PF (not by me)
[ QUOTE ]
I'd never wait for the turn with a flopped set. I would want to build the pot as big as possible. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah I usually do to and without thinking about it during the hand I probably do it here to but is it right? Say the flop in this hand comes 5 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] In a pot this big anybody with a flush draw or oesd is staying in but what about gutshots (4 outs) or pairs that assume they need two pair or trips to win (5 outs) (yeah I know the two pair won't help them but since they don't know that we won't call it a mistake to chase this). Four outs needs 10.5:1 and 5 outs need 8:1 so they are right to call for one bet. Now say we check, BB checks, UTG bets, CO calls and we raise. BB now faces 2 SB with a 20 SB pot and two players left to act. He's usuallu going to be correct to call and all 4 players will still be in. Now assume we bet, BB calls, UTG raises and faces CO with 2 bets. He needs to put in 2 SB in a 19 SB pot. He is correct to call with 5 outs and given the implied odds probably correct to call with a gutshot as well. So he calls, and you raise. BB is now faced with 2 SB in a 23 SB pot so he calls too. Either way no body makes a mistake and no body is elimated so since you are almost certainly aheadI think the play is to lead the flop. The turn though may be a time to c/r. Say we lead out the turn and the action went as follows: Hero bets, BB calls, UTG raises, CO calls, Hero raises, BB calls, UTG calls, CO calls. The turn is a blank. We now have 4 players in a 14BB pot. Now we arein a spot where anyone with 4 or 5 outs who is facedwitha double bet will be making a mistake to call so how do we make that happen? With the aggression we have shown already if we lead the turn it is unlikely that anyone will raise so it will likely be right for everyone to stay in. If we chack some hyperaggressive type might bet and give us a chance to raise but we risk having this check through which may allow a free card that beats us and puts no more money in the pot when we are ahead. Given these options unless you can be really sure that an opponent will bet if you check leading the flop is correct. So once again it looks like just playing as fast as possible with no trickery is correct here.... funny how often that is true [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] 
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#13
08-05-2006, 11:56 AM
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Re: 55 hand...*shakes head* capped PF (not by me)
Great posts guys.
[ QUOTE ] meh, variance hand. calls are fine. [/ QUOTE ] [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] Turn: 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Hero...?
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#14
08-05-2006, 12:16 PM
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Re: 55 hand...*shakes head* capped PF (not by me)
[ QUOTE ]
Great posts guys. [ QUOTE ] meh, variance hand. calls are fine. [/ QUOTE ] [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] Turn: 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Hero...? [/ QUOTE ] checks
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#15
08-05-2006, 12:22 PM
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Re: 55 hand...*shakes head* capped PF (not by me)
[ QUOTE ]
Great posts guys. [ QUOTE ] meh, variance hand. calls are fine. [/ QUOTE ] [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] Turn: 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Hero...? [/ QUOTE ] Complains to CS because there are only 3 board cards on the turn.
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#17
08-05-2006, 12:36 PM
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Re: 55 hand...*shakes head* capped PF (not by me)
[ QUOTE ]
ya im just saying a donk bet/3bet would be a much better value bet line followed by c/r the turn and then trapping them for 2 cold =p but [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] its all the same [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] This line sucks. Your flop 3bet will often scare people into checking through the turn. I'm not a fan of the first pf call but the second one is mandatory. Flop call is ok getting 19:1 closing the action. Turn I'd probably c/r since with this many people staying in, someone is probably going to have a hand worth betting.
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#18
08-05-2006, 12:37 PM
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Re: 55 hand...*shakes head* capped PF (not by me)
I say bet just because BB might stop his aggression after missing his overcards. Also, you have a good chance of knocking both out now that they may suspect you have a 3 and made trips on the flop. In heaven, you bet, they raise and reraise, you cap and then they pee their pants.
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#19
08-05-2006, 12:42 PM
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Re: 55 hand...*shakes head* capped PF (not by me)
[ QUOTE ]
Hero checks, BB bets, UTG calls, CO calls, Hero calls. Turn: 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Bet or C-R? [/ QUOTE ] bet C/R will stink of slowplayed 3, and by making a suspicious donk right here, overcards might even peel edit - on an aside note, I might toss this one on the flop though.... EDIT2 - I lie about my above edit, how big is the pot now? we're getting like 1:22 or so?
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#20
08-05-2006, 02:56 PM
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Re: 55 hand...*shakes head* capped PF (not by me)
[ QUOTE ]
EDIT2 - I lie about my above edit, how big is the pot now? we're getting like 1:22 or so? [/ QUOTE ] 4 people capped pf including the blinds = 16SB One bet and 2 calls on flop = 3 SB So 19SB minus rake, plenty on this board since only 88 and 33 can realistically make it a mistake to call.
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