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#11
11-08-2006, 07:14 AM
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Re: Early small stack shoves. My AK?
[ QUOTE ]
Given the stacks behind, my stack and the relatively small push, I actually quite like a call here. I'm happy to encourage any action behind except from the BB. If I'm not calling a push from BB after I've isoraised, then I don't see the point in isoraising. [/ QUOTE ] Agreed, flat calling may lead some of the small stacks to push thinking they have odds. If someone flat calls, I probably wouldn't lay it down postflop no matter what with these stack sizes, and would open push pretty much any flop. If the big stack reraises, your action is going to be read-dependent. I probably wouldn't fold to anyone but tighties/straightforward players. 
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#12
11-08-2006, 10:52 AM
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Re: Early small stack shoves. My AK?
i like a reraise to 9k as well. ak is an excellent racing hand which is what u want here w/ the original raiser. however, with the big stack at the bb your postion is unfavorable to say the least. alot has to depend upon what kind of read you have on the big stack too. a push could prove to be disatrous.
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#13
11-08-2006, 11:12 AM
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Re: Early small stack shoves. My AK?
I'm raising to 9-10k and calling any pushes, including one from the BB. His range would probably be much wider than JJ+,AK and we would be given good odds against that range. Calling seems too weak and pushing is WAY too strong. If BB has been REALLY tight I would fold to a re-raise, but I would need really convincing evidence to fold there.
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#14
11-08-2006, 11:23 AM
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Re: Early small stack shoves. My AK?
[ QUOTE ]
I'm raising to 9-10k and calling any pushes, including one from the BB. His range would probably be much wider than JJ+,AK and we would be given good odds against that range. Calling seems too weak and pushing is WAY too strong. If BB has been REALLY tight I would fold to a re-raise, but I would need really convincing evidence to fold there. [/ QUOTE ] Calling isn't weak in this situation. Calling is inviting pushes behind whereas pushing isn't. In an ideal world, we call and the guy with 15k looks down at AQs and pushes. In my OP I didn't say that I would fold to a push from BB, just that I wouldn't isolate raise and then fold.
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#15
11-08-2006, 11:43 AM
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Re: Early small stack shoves. My AK?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I'm raising to 9-10k and calling any pushes, including one from the BB. His range would probably be much wider than JJ+,AK and we would be given good odds against that range. Calling seems too weak and pushing is WAY too strong. If BB has been REALLY tight I would fold to a re-raise, but I would need really convincing evidence to fold there. [/ QUOTE ] Calling isn't weak in this situation. Calling is inviting pushes behind whereas pushing isn't. In an ideal world, we call and the guy with 15k looks down at AQs and pushes. In my OP I didn't say that I would fold to a push from BB, just that I wouldn't isolate raise and then fold. [/ QUOTE ] I was just clarifying my one sentence "raise to 9k" to just point out that I wouldn't be folding to resistance. I think even if we raise to 9k the guy w/ 15k could still push if he looks down at AQ.
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#17
11-09-2006, 03:15 PM
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Re: Early small stack shoves. My AK?
[ QUOTE ]
I'm raising to 9-10k and calling any pushes, including one from the BB. His range would probably be much wider than JJ+,AK and we would be given good odds against that range. Calling seems too weak and pushing is WAY too strong. If BB has been REALLY tight I would fold to a re-raise, but I would need really convincing evidence to fold there. [/ QUOTE ] i think we'd have to already now that BB is a manaiac if we really believe he's coming over the top of an early push and a reraise with any hand we are ahead of. In which case, i'm not one to call off my whole stack when i know i'm behind and i have plenty of chips still behind me. as far as flat calling, AK is not a strong enough hand to invite more action. you want this hand racing heads up, not oop in a multi-way pot.
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#18
11-09-2006, 04:09 PM
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Re: Early small stack shoves. My AK?
[ QUOTE ]
I'm raising to 9-10k and calling any pushes, including one from the BB. His range would probably be much wider than JJ+,AK and we would be given good odds against that range. Calling seems too weak and pushing is WAY too strong. If BB has been REALLY tight I would fold to a re-raise, but I would need really convincing evidence to fold there. [/ QUOTE ] If you decide, before you raise, that you are definately calling the BB's push, then IMO, you should just push allin here instead of raising it to 9K. The BB is the only stack that concerns you. If you raise to 9k, and one of the smaller stacks pushes, you have an obvious call. If you are calling the BB anyway, and you are raising, then a push here is best.
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#19
11-09-2006, 04:19 PM
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Re: Early small stack shoves. My AK?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I'm raising to 9-10k and calling any pushes, including one from the BB. His range would probably be much wider than JJ+,AK and we would be given good odds against that range. Calling seems too weak and pushing is WAY too strong. If BB has been REALLY tight I would fold to a re-raise, but I would need really convincing evidence to fold there. [/ QUOTE ] Calling isn't weak in this situation. Calling is inviting pushes behind whereas pushing isn't. In an ideal world, we call and the guy with 15k looks down at AQs and pushes. In my OP I didn't say that I would fold to a push from BB, just that I wouldn't isolate raise and then fold. [/ QUOTE ] I was just clarifying my one sentence "raise to 9k" to just point out that I wouldn't be folding to resistance. I think even if we raise to 9k the guy w/ 15k could still push if he looks down at AQ. [/ QUOTE ] Flat call, call all pushes except from BB if our read on him is super-nit. Calling may give SOME of these players an idae that our hand is not as strong and may cause them to push slightly lighter than they really should. Also, knowing the buy-in level for this tourney would help.
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#20
11-09-2006, 04:23 PM
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Re: Early small stack shoves. My AK?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I'm raising to 9-10k and calling any pushes, including one from the BB. His range would probably be much wider than JJ+,AK and we would be given good odds against that range. Calling seems too weak and pushing is WAY too strong. If BB has been REALLY tight I would fold to a re-raise, but I would need really convincing evidence to fold there. [/ QUOTE ] i think we'd have to already now that BB is a manaiac if we really believe he's coming over the top of an early push and a reraise with any hand we are ahead of. In which case, i'm not one to call off my whole stack when i know i'm behind and i have plenty of chips still behind me. as far as flat calling, AK is not a strong enough hand to invite more action. you want this hand racing heads up, not oop in a multi-way pot. [/ QUOTE ] I'm still looking for a SINGLE point you have made that I can agree with. Bolded section - if we will be all-in PF, how does the OOP matter? Also, try stoving AK against some ranges of 2 villains, and you'll understand why I'd like to INVITE, not DISCOURAGE extra action.
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