200NL Q5s flopped two pair against a potential degenerate bluffer

[xSCWx]

Alright I just ran some INTENSE math using estimated numbers for how often we were ahead, how often we would be called if we shoved, how often he would give up on the river when behind, etc. I had a HUGE post typed out with about a zillion numbers and possible hands he could have and estimates all kinds of stuff.

After like a half hour of number crunching and furiously typing: I came to the conclusion that regardless of if you shove the flop or if you wait to the river your average profit is almost exactly the same.

My brain hurts.

[jay_shark]

I think the preflop call is really interesting . Against a solid player , I would strongly consider folding . I think against a poor player (like this guy) , then calling is not bad .

[Vinetou]

[ QUOTE ]
Alright I just ran some INTENSE math using estimated numbers for how often we were ahead, how often we would be called if we shoved, how often he would give up on the river when behind, etc. I had a HUGE post typed out with about a zillion numbers and possible hands he could have and estimates all kinds of stuff.

After like a half hour of number crunching and furiously typing: I came to the conclusion that regardless of if you shove the flop or if you wait to the river your average profit is almost exactly the same.

My brain hurts.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am interesting in that post. If you have it saved somewhere, otherwise don't do it again.

[xSCWx]

I wish I had saved it, it took really long.

[haugsrud]

why dont you reraise the turn? too many bad cards can come on the river

[xSCWx]

[ QUOTE ]
why dont you reraise the turn? too many bad cards can come on the river

[/ QUOTE ]

A reraise on the turn basically has to put the villain all in, and because the turn made a possible flush draw, he will probably fold out anything worse and only be called by stronger hands.

[jakeduke]

I don't mind how you played this hand as long as you called the river. Once you decide to call the flop and turn, you're pretty much saying his hand is a bluff. The king might give him two pair, or he may have already been ahead, but you can't fold now.

Normally I'd just raise the flop since your hand is so vulnerable.

[redCashion]

I use lines like this often against "maniacs", since I want to give them all the rope they can take and also know that their range can be sick wide. It feels like crap to stack off when you let them get there, but I still think it's +EV to call them down since there is a good chance they will get it in whether they hit strongly or not.

[haugsrud]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
why dont you reraise the turn? too many bad cards can come on the river

[/ QUOTE ]

A reraise on the turn basically has to put the villain all in, and because the turn made a possible flush draw, he will probably fold out anything worse and only be called by stronger hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

if you play an aggressive game, villain will absolutely not fold out everything because the flush hits...

[dboy23]

yeah I think the flop is too drawy to just call.