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#11
07-14-2007, 07:53 PM
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Re: Child rapists, evils, and the state
You can't answer the question.
Your post is poorly thought out and makes no sense. You can't even answer a basic question about what you wrote. Your attempts to duck my question make even LESS sense. 
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#12
07-14-2007, 07:57 PM
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Re: Child rapists, evils, and the state
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Answer the question; it was not rhetorical. [/ QUOTE ] Actually what I am interested in doing is developing a list of some of statism's other evils over and above this evil. If a child rapist in jail is examined by a doctor who idicates open heart surgety should be performed on him should an additional 100K be stolen in order to provide him wiht this service as well? What is the maximum $'s that should be given for the care and feeding of a child rapist in your opinion? How much should we give to him (after it is forcibly stolen from people) to pay for legal services should he be sentenced to death? [/ QUOTE ] Under that system, 100 billion dollars, or any amount because I too might be accused of a crime I didn't commit, need surgery and be denied because of a label. My lord, are you seriously suggesting we let popular opinion decide who's innocent and guilty? That we don't make an attempt to promise fairness and equality under the law? Of what consolation will it be to the man wrongly accused of murder that the free market decided he should die. Cody
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#13
07-14-2007, 08:10 PM
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Re: Child rapists, evils, and the state
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Answer the question; it was not rhetorical. [/ QUOTE ] Actually what I am interested in doing is developing a list of some of statism's other evils over and above this evil. If a child rapist in jail is examined by a doctor who idicates open heart surgety should be performed on him should an additional 100K be stolen in order to provide him wiht this service as well? What is the maximum $'s that should be given for the care and feeding of a child rapist in your opinion? How much should we give to him (after it is forcibly stolen from people) to pay for legal services should he be sentenced to death? [/ QUOTE ] Under that system, 100 billion dollars, or any amount because I too might be accused of a crime I didn't commit, need surgery and be denied because of a label. [/ QUOTE ] So 100billion per person on death row? Twice Bill Gates net worth per person on death row is the correct amount? Is that correct?
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#14
07-14-2007, 08:15 PM
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Re: Child rapists, evils, and the state
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Answer the question; it was not rhetorical. [/ QUOTE ] Actually what I am interested in doing is developing a list of some of statism's other evils over and above this evil. If a child rapist in jail is examined by a doctor who idicates open heart surgety should be performed on him should an additional 100K be stolen in order to provide him wiht this service as well? What is the maximum $'s that should be given for the care and feeding of a child rapist in your opinion? How much should we give to him (after it is forcibly stolen from people) to pay for legal services should he be sentenced to death? [/ QUOTE ] Under that system, 100 billion dollars, or any amount because I too might be accused of a crime I didn't commit, need surgery and be denied because of a label. [/ QUOTE ] So 100billion per person on death row? Twice Bill Gates net worth per person on death row is the correct amount? Is that correct? [/ QUOTE ] Your hyperbole detector might be malfunctioning, have it checked. Cody
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#15
07-14-2007, 08:16 PM
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Re: Child rapists, evils, and the state
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Answer the question; it was not rhetorical. [/ QUOTE ] Actually what I am interested in doing is developing a list of some of statism's other evils over and above this evil. If a child rapist in jail is examined by a doctor who idicates open heart surgety should be performed on him should an additional 100K be stolen in order to provide him wiht this service as well? What is the maximum $'s that should be given for the care and feeding of a child rapist in your opinion? How much should we give to him (after it is forcibly stolen from people) to pay for legal services should he be sentenced to death? [/ QUOTE ] Under that system, 100 billion dollars, or any amount because I too might be accused of a crime I didn't commit, need surgery and be denied because of a label. [/ QUOTE ] So 100billion per person on death row? Twice Bill Gates net worth per person on death row is the correct amount? Is that correct? [/ QUOTE ] Your hyperbole detector might be malfunctioning, have it checked. Cody [/ QUOTE ] So what is the correct amount?
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#16
07-14-2007, 08:17 PM
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Re: Child rapists, evils, and the state
My lord, are you seriously suggesting we let popular opinion decide who's innocent and guilty? I dont think anyone is advocating that, he is talking about people already convicted of a crime, so by default they are considered guilty. I agree with forced slavery, for more extreme child rape/molestation cases.
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#17
07-14-2007, 08:42 PM
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Re: Child rapists, evils, and the state
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Answer the question; it was not rhetorical. [/ QUOTE ] Actually what I am interested in doing is developing a list of some of statism's other evils over and above this evil. If a child rapist in jail is examined by a doctor who idicates open heart surgety should be performed on him should an additional 100K be stolen in order to provide him wiht this service as well? What is the maximum $'s that should be given for the care and feeding of a child rapist in your opinion? How much should we give to him (after it is forcibly stolen from people) to pay for legal services should he be sentenced to death? [/ QUOTE ] Under that system, 100 billion dollars, or any amount because I too might be accused of a crime I didn't commit, need surgery and be denied because of a label. [/ QUOTE ] So 100billion per person on death row? Twice Bill Gates net worth per person on death row is the correct amount? Is that correct? [/ QUOTE ] Your hyperbole detector might be malfunctioning, have it checked. Cody [/ QUOTE ] So what is the correct amount? [/ QUOTE ] You can't possibly expect an answer here can you? It's far too specific a problem to get an answer out of. Cody
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#18
07-14-2007, 08:43 PM
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Re: Child rapists, evils, and the state
Pedophilia is a mental illness, trying to punish someone for it by sending them to a labor camp or whatever you guys want is beyond inhumane. I don't want to live in a society like that. If your line of thinking is "they abuse children and should be punished proportionally" you don't understand the issue, it is not a simple issue like a lot of people like to treat it as.
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#19
07-14-2007, 08:50 PM
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Re: Child rapists, evils, and the state
bk,
I am going to break my politics forum hiatus temporarily to make a post here in this interesting thread. To those talking about lynching those only suspected of child rape, note that bk is assuming a convicted such person, and one who wasn't unjustly so convicted. So you need to argue from that premise. The question here applies not only to these most heinous/repulsvie types of criminals, but to all criminals incarcerated by the state. And bk's obvious conclusion is that citizens shouldn't be forced to pay for that incarcertation or medical procedures to keep those criminals alive. Which is *obviously* true. However that is not an argument for the death penalty. What it does argue for is that the criminals should be forced to work in some prodcutive endeavour to support themselves, so that the citizens aren't vicitmized twice, once by the original crime, and again by having to pay for their room and board and medical expenses while in prison. But that has to be balanced against the interest of society in assuring that those criminals don't escape and be loosed on the citizenry again, or at least prematurely, or commit serious crimes against guards and other inmates. So it is society which has to choose whether to risk a greater chance of escape/harm to inmates and guards, or instead to pay for more rigid incarceration that isn't terribly productive. I doubt you could think of a way to have the most violent inmates incarcerated in super-max prisons earn their own living and medical expenses, and also not be a threat to other inmates or guards, or pose a much greater risk of escape. However the flaw in your (bk's) use of this example is that you start from another premise, which is that taxation, even in a democracy, is coercive and wrong. And then by application of the axiom that the ends don't justify the means, you would also have to argue that citizens shouldn't be forced to spend $X billions of dollars on the medical care of indigent child victims of those rapists who can benefit from same, but would otherwise not lead productive lives or even die without it. Thus from your AC "the state is unjustly coercive in taxing" perspective, there is a moral equivalence in the wrongness of supporting at taxpayer expense, either the child rapist in prison, or the child victim of same who is indigent and in need of expensive medical care as a result of his suffering at the hands of that rapist. And even so, none of this rebuts an argument that government should merely spend its citizens' taxes more wisely on things, rather than eliminating "coercive taxation". The premise that the state is an unjust coercive entity is not proved by examples of wrongful uses of taxes, unless it be proven that the state is totally incapable of spending a majority of funds in non-corrupt and wise manners. And since there can be shown a difference between largely corrupt states and ones that mostly aren't, then it must be possible for the state to do a better and wiser job in its use of taxes, even if that's not the case currently in any discrete example. P.S. It should be neither cruel nor unusual under the U.S. constitution to madate a sentence of physical castration for pedophiles convicted of multiple offenses (to eliminate possiblity of wrongful prosecution). That is a just penalty, and one that insures that their uncurable evil urges can never harm another child.
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#20
07-14-2007, 08:57 PM
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Re: Child rapists, evils, and the state
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Answer the question; it was not rhetorical. [/ QUOTE ] Actually what I am interested in doing is developing a list of some of statism's other evils over and above this evil. If a child rapist in jail is examined by a doctor who idicates open heart surgety should be performed on him should an additional 100K be stolen in order to provide him wiht this service as well? What is the maximum $'s that should be given for the care and feeding of a child rapist in your opinion? How much should we give to him (after it is forcibly stolen from people) to pay for legal services should he be sentenced to death? [/ QUOTE ] Under that system, 100 billion dollars, or any amount because I too might be accused of a crime I didn't commit, need surgery and be denied because of a label. [/ QUOTE ] So 100billion per person on death row? Twice Bill Gates net worth per person on death row is the correct amount? Is that correct? [/ QUOTE ] Your hyperbole detector might be malfunctioning, have it checked. Cody [/ QUOTE ] So what is the correct amount? [/ QUOTE ] You can't possibly expect an answer here can you? It's far too specific a problem to get an answer out of. Cody [/ QUOTE ] Should there be a cap or not?
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