Congratulations! You just became the manager of a Vegas poker room!

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
9. Management does not promote pot limit and no limit games.
A. Weak players almost never win.
B. Cheating accusations are inevitable.
C. Takes up a table that could be used for other games.

Every cardroom that I have ever seen that promotes pot limit and/or no limit games on a regular basis has run into trouble.

[/ QUOTE ]

Two questions and an observation.

i. Does this point apply anymore? It seems that the only good middle-stakes games these days are in fact no-limit games. Restricted buy-ins help keep the weaker players from going busto as quickly, which helps the health of these games.

ii. To follow up on the above, do rooms on the Strip offering uncapped low-stakes and middle-stakes NL games heading for disaster? Or will the continuing expansion of poker mitigate it?

iii. I think it does apply insofar as trying to get a 30-60 going. Most of your live ones for 30-60 are probably playing 5-10 NL instead (which is usually uncapped on the Strip). 5-10 games decimate the medium limit games not only in the casino which they are spread, but in a wider area also.

But what are you going to do about it? I mean, the reason people are playing 5-10 NL is because they want to play that instead of 30-60. You can't really be successful as a cardroom if you don't offer the games people really want to play. Can you?

[/ QUOTE ]

The old ways of thinking about NL are out of date. NL is the predominant game now and is likely to be so for quite some time. The fact that rooms in the past that focused on NL failed has zero to do with today. Similarly, I have yet to be convinced that capped buy-ins matter at all, though perhaps in the 1-2 games it's ok to have like a $200max just to allow the new players to avoid being as intimidated.

A few other thougths:

Mason's point about the head of the poker room being on the floor is absolutely correct. There's no reason that the Director of Poker Operations shouldn't be on the floor at least 65% of the time, and they should also have a schedule that allows them to be present on all shifts from time to time, and especially on swing during Saturday.

2. I disagree that the freeroll promotion is bad. It's a good alternative to bad ideas like rake reduction. They are generally profitable, though the Venetian may have overshot it with the $500k amount.

3. The Wynn made a huge mistake running out Cathleen McCall. Comping issues aside, she was hands-down the best poker room shift I have run across, and I never tipped her a dime (I'm not a fan of tipping salaried room personell).

4. I agree that the must move stuff is pretty terrible for all the reasons given. It also cements the "we can't play shorthanded" mindset.

5. 10-handed holdem tables are an abomination.

6. As someone mentioned, there needs to simply be a standard rake/time schedule as in California. Wynn started doing this in the 30/60 with 5-handed or less being half-time. Much clearer, fairer and faster. Avoids hard feelings. Rooms should just post it on the tables.

[CountStackula]

I just want you all to know that I just got to the Venetian, it is Tues. morn around 10ish, they have a 15/30 game going. It went around the clock, and from what the players and shift boss say...it was a GREAT game.

Again, it looks like they are doing something right.

[*TT*]

[ QUOTE ]
I just want you all to know that I just got to the Venetian, it is Tues. morn around 10ish, they have a 15/30 game going. It went around the clock, and from what the players and shift boss say...it was a GREAT game.

Again, it looks like they are doing something right.

[/ QUOTE ]

ONE 15 game... think about it, Bellagio had 4 last night, Wynn probably had 2 and it was a Monday. I was there on Saturday, it was a meh game at best at the time. The promotion is only filling chairs at the moment, they probably wont remain filled. The same thing happened last year at the V.

[Clarkmeister]

Oh, also, the poker host idea is a very good one.

Another point I missed is that casinos are very aware of ancillary gaming revenue from poker players. The idea that they aren't aware is incorrect.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I just want you all to know that I just got to the Venetian, it is Tues. morn around 10ish, they have a 15/30 game going. It went around the clock, and from what the players and shift boss say...it was a GREAT game.

Again, it looks like they are doing something right.

[/ QUOTE ]

ONE 15 game... think about it, Bellagio had 4 last night, Wynn probably had 2 and it was a Monday. I was there on Saturday, it was a meh game at best at the time. The promotion is only filling chairs at the moment, they probably wont remain filled. The same thing happened last year at the V.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yup. I could sell more Big Mac's than any other McDonald's franchise if I sold them for $0.10 each.

[Rottersod]

Why is this in the classic threads?

[*TT*]

[ QUOTE ]
Why is this in the classic threads?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because it is influencing business operations of poker rooms as we speak, thats pretty impressive for 2+2.

[Guruman]

k, I’ve read the whole thing. My thoughts:



[/ QUOTE ]

Bad ideas I’ve seen so far:

1) Rake reduction

is irrelevant, and bubbled rake reduction is probably harmful for reasons already stated. Actions players in that game don’t give a [censored] about rake, and if you don’t rake them while they’re 5 handed they’ll start to think about rake when the 6th guy sits in.

2) Trinkets

are irrelevant and a waste of time. Mid and high limit players are unlikely to be swayed by card protectors, jackets, et all. The types of players that are influenced by these things are more likely to play lower limits and are more likely to only be mildly and temporarily influenced by such promos.



[/ QUOTE ]

Specific problems that need to be addressed (in no specific order):

1) Aversion to shorthanded play when there are full tables running
2) Need for players to be informed and active in table and game selection
3) 30/60 game needs prestige unassociated with the stakes
4) Player pool needs to reach beyond the poker room rails
5) The 30/60 game needs to cross-pollinate with the pits
6) Need for great service
7) The games need to be good



[/ QUOTE ]

1) Aversion to shorthanded play when there are full tables running
4) Player pool needs to reach beyond the poker room rails

I believe that these two problems can largely be addressed with web presence and poker room associations.

Specifically:

-Form an association with Poker Stars. Stars has a huge American player base full of qualified (the marketing version of “qualified”) potential customers. They all have bankrolls, they are all gamblers, they all have a minimum level of tech-savvy, and they all know how the game works. They are also by and large unafraid to play shorthanded.

Included in this association could be:
-FPP freerolls for room comps.
-Room comps and discounts in the FPP store
-playing in the live poker room can accumulate Stars FPP points.
-one more kller app to be discussed later

-Also have a kickass website with all of the following in place and running correctly:

-live webcam of the poker room
-live webcam of the overhead view of a specific 30/60 table.
-up to the minute listing of all games currently running
-status of any tourneys in action
-phone number to the poker room clearly listed
-links to full description of
--poker room rules
--poker room comp policies
--game specific rules
--cool things that this room does that others don’t



[/ QUOTE ]

2) Need for players to be informed and active in table and game selection
4) Player pool needs to reach beyond the poker room rails

User and brush interactive lists available both online and at a terminal in the poker room, specifically:

--User ability to add/remove his name from the lists of specific games on the poker room terminal but not on the online interface
--User ability to remove his name from any list at both places.
--User accessible future availability lists (ex. a user is at home, but will be at the casino in an hour and will be available to play the 10/20 limit holdem game at that time for a window of about 3 hours)
--a “will play shorthanded” checkbox
--user ability to express interest in specific games that are already running
--a cell phone dialogue box, with a drop menu to choose either text message or phone call when a seat becomes available.
--a system to track repeated no-shows so that the integrity of the list can be maintained. If a player no-shows more than twice in a row, his remote list privileges are revoked for x period of time. This policy will be clear and transparent. Also, the user will be notified if he triggers it.



[/ QUOTE ]

4) Player pool needs to reach beyond the poker room rails
5) The 30/60 game needs to cross-pollinate with the pits

I have no idea why the poker rooms are always isolated from the pits. Even if you place the poker tables right next to the pit games, you’re still isolating them by grouping them all together and treating poker players differently than pit players because they sit there for hours. Why not mix and mingle?

What if the “table games” section of the casino also included the poker tables? I assume its just an organizational thing, but that could be solved instantly by numbering every table in the casino and clearly displaying that number overhead. Then you could have an electronic menu up that has all of the games listed:

Table 1: Blackjack $10
Table 2: Blackjack $10
Table 3: Pai Gow $20
Table 4: Limit Holdem $15/30 [Kill]
Table 5: Craps $20
Table 6: Limit Holdem $30/60 [Open Seats!]
Table 7: Craps $10
Table 8: Three Card Poker $10
Table 9: Craps $10
Table 10: No limit Holdem $2/5 [Open Seats!]
etc.

Heard overhead: “Attention all players and players Tom, Dick and Harry. There are now seats available at the thirty sixty limit holdem game on table 6. Thank you!”

If intermingling the tables is not feasible for some reason that I’m unaware of, then at least consider putting a few blackjack tables in the poker room.



[/ QUOTE ]

3) 30/60 game needs prestige unassociated with the stakes
7) The games needs to be good

The prestige factor can be addressed in multiple ways:

-a live webcam and closed circuit feed of the 30/60 table from overhead
-a slightly elevated “feature table” platform with special lighting on which to play the game. Also a central location within the other tables.
-different colored felt (this is actually pretty big)
-poker room merch available for purchase that mentions the feature table. This merch should be available in the poker room, probably at the cashier.

goodness can be addressed with a couple of promos:

-aces never lose:

These are the terms and conditions of this promotion from WPEX:

<font color="blue">
Aces Never Lose
• This promotion applies to real-money Texas Hold 'em &amp; 7-Card Stud games only (7-Stud H/L games are not eligible).
• Three or more players must be dealt into the hand for it to qualify.
• A hand must go to a showdown to qualify.
• 7-Stud: Both your 1st two cards down (hole cards) AND your last card down (7th Street) constitute a qualifying hand for this promotion.
A losing player with pocket aces receives funds at the following levels:
NL/PL$100 = $25.00 NL/PL$200 = $25.00
$1/$2 = $25.00 $2/$4 = $25.00
$3/$6 = $50.00 $5/$10 = $50.00
$8/$16 = $50.00 $10/$20 &amp; higher = $75.00
(Fixed-limit tables of $.50/$1 and under are not eligible; no-limit/pot-limit tables of under $.50/$1 are not eligible.)</font>

The poker room could run an adaptation of this for just the $15/30 through $30/60 games.

-Joetall claims bad beat jackpots stir the $25/50 action up like crazy at the Hustler:
-any other promo that encourages loose and passive play by rewarding poor hands.



[/ QUOTE ]


6) Need for great service

Of course Mason’s article addressed that and should be referred to frequently.


[/ QUOTE ]

-[radical idea]

Get some PokerTek style tables and work with Stars developers to create hybrid games: games where live players can battle internet players!! No dealers needed, no chips needed really. Make the stakes only for 30/60 and have a clearly visible “sit in” button by each chair. Sell novelty items to people who play in this game. Give live players a special icon both at the table and online. Split the rake between the room and stars.

Presto. A perpetually full table that:
-requires no dealer and fewer cocktails
-is still cross pollinated with the pit games
-is a huge and marketable novelty
-increases the internet presence and therefore the poker list presence
-has a huge player base and is self-sustainable



[/ QUOTE ]

Of course, the things I’ve suggested would require large doses of common sense, front end organization and effort, commitment from management, flexibility, technology investment and maintenance, and negotiation with the online room.

All of the commitments needed to get a good 30/60 game shouldn’t be taken lightly, but the internet has certainly proven that there is a large base of players out there just itching to get into a game. If the room promotes a loose game, executes on the service end, and fully utilizes the internet and internal software to organize and inform it should have a good game running in no time.

[Phat Mack]

[ QUOTE ]
The Headache: Both locals and tourists hate short games...

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think the above is true. I think that some locals, and fewer tourists dislike short-handed games. The problem is that it only takes one or two nits, and a complicit dealer, to kill short-handed action.

How do they do it? By stopping the game for near endless discussions on the rake and the blinds. Shorthanded players are action players, and they won't sit around for 20 or 30 minutes while some sulking local tries to get the juice or the blinds reduced.

If it is made known that the game will always start/continue with anything between 2 an 10 players, what the fees will be, and, hopefully, that there will be no diminution of the blinds, then the dealers will won't have an excuse to stop the action.

Dealers should be instructed to never utter the word "wait." They should ask new and posting players if they want to be in action, not if they want to wait.

Players who wish to not play short, and who are know to be locals, should be given a button with the word "Pussy" written on it.

Dealers should also be instructed to never stop dealing. They can deal and yell for the floor at the same time.

I'd estimate that over 50% of the short-handed games I've sat in on in Vegas were killed by tuculent dealers or floors. I've no way of estimating how many short-handed games could have been started and weren't.

30-60, played with a big SB, is an action game. Action players have to be accomodated for it to succeed.

[Bremen]

[ QUOTE ]
Dealers should be instructed to never utter the word "wait." They should ask new and posting players if they want to be in action, not if they want to wait.


[/ QUOTE ]
This a an excellent idea. Unfortunately I don't see the pussy button being introduced anytime soon although it would be freakin cool.