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#1
11-21-2007, 03:10 AM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Why don't the polygamists have the same rights as gays? Who are we to deny those 3, 4, 5, or 30 people the right to a legal marriage and all of the benefits? [/ QUOTE ] [/ QUOTE ] Why are you quoting your own question again? People have agreed that granting govt benefits to some while denying same benefits to others (i.e., polygamists) is wrong. You are the one who is advocating such a policy when it comes to gays. You aren't making a case for one discrimination just by giving an example of another discrimination. But if that's the best you got and have to try it a second time, then I guess its safe to say you concede the argument. 
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#3
11-21-2007, 11:14 AM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
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No, I want to know the people's view on polygamy. What's yours? [/ QUOTE ] I don't particularly care for it. But I don't want to impose my values on others at the point of a gun. If minors are being taken advantage of, that is a different story and I might get a gun to help them if needed.
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#4
11-21-2007, 12:18 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] No, I want to know the people's view on polygamy. What's yours? [/ QUOTE ] I don't particularly care for it. But I don't want to impose my values on others at the point of a gun. If minors are being taken advantage of, that is a different story and I might get a gun to help them if needed. [/ QUOTE ] Bravo. Perfect answer. natedogg
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#5
11-21-2007, 11:20 AM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
No, I want to know the people's view on polygamy. What's yours? [/ QUOTE ] Polygamists should have to choose 1 spouse to whom "marriage" benefits should pass. There are legitimate state interests in limiting the scope of marriage to two individuals. There are not legitimate state interests in limiting the scope of marriage to people of different genders (as discriminating on the basis of gender is not a legitimate state interest.)
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#6
11-21-2007, 12:00 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] No, I want to know the people's view on polygamy. What's yours? [/ QUOTE ] Polygamists should have to choose 1 spouse to whom "marriage" benefits should pass. There are legitimate state interests in limiting the scope of marriage to two individuals. There are not legitimate state interests in limiting the scope of marriage to people of different genders (as discriminating on the basis of gender is not a legitimate state interest.) [/ QUOTE ] Ok, so you agree that marriage laws should have limits. Sadly, your opinion on where those lines are to be drawn goes against a vast majority of the rest of the public. I do appreciate the vague "Well, there are legitimate state interests in limiting the marriage benefits to two people." comment though. You did a fantastic job supporting that opinion. This might not be true for women, but I wholeheartedly believe that if men were legally allowed to marry other men, you'd see bachelors snatching up $12 marriage licenses left and right and entering into legal contracts with other bachelor friends for the tax benefits. Now, you have to consider what that would do to private benefit packages offered by employers. If I'm single and my best friend is a government employee, what's stopping me from paying my $12 for our marriage license so I can get put on to his healthcare plan? You'll say it's impractical... and I'll say you're just blind to the possibilities. 1) Split $12 marriage license cost with buddy 2) Reap tax/healthcare plan/etc etc etc marriage benefits 3) ?????? 4) PROFIT 5) ?????? 6) Find someone you actually want to marry 7) Get $200 divorce from buddy from Legalzoom.com 8) Get married properly 9) ??????? 10) CONTINUE TO PROFIT
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#7
11-21-2007, 12:05 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] No, I want to know the people's view on polygamy. What's yours? [/ QUOTE ] Polygamists should have to choose 1 spouse to whom "marriage" benefits should pass. There are legitimate state interests in limiting the scope of marriage to two individuals. There are not legitimate state interests in limiting the scope of marriage to people of different genders (as discriminating on the basis of gender is not a legitimate state interest.) [/ QUOTE ] Ok, so you agree that marriage laws should have limits. Sadly, your opinion on where those lines are to be drawn goes against a vast majority of the rest of the public. I do appreciate the vague "Well, there are legitimate state interests in limiting the marriage benefits to two people." comment though. You did a fantastic job supporting that opinion. This might not be true for women, but I wholeheartedly believe that if men were legally allowed to marry other men, you'd see bachelors snatching up $12 marriage licenses left and right and entering into legal contracts with other bachelor friends for the tax benefits. Now, you have to consider what that would do to private benefit packages offered by employers. If I'm single and my best friend is a government employee, what's stopping me from paying my $12 for our marriage license so I can get put on to his healthcare plan? You'll say it's impractical... and I say you're just blind to the possibilities. 1) Split $12 marriage license cost with buddy 2) Reap tax/healthcare plan/etc etc etc marriage benefits 3) ?????? 4) PROFIT 5) ?????? 6) Find someone you actually want to marry 7) Get $200 divorce from buddy from Legalzoom.com 8) Get married properly 9) ??????? 10) CONTINUE TO PROFIT [/ QUOTE ] So you admit there are all kinds of financial reasons to marry. And you use this as a defense for denying these benefits to adults who clearly have a "marriage-like" relationship because in your hypothetical world these benefits may then be given to other single people who are also discriminated against by marriage benefits. This is a silly argument. The problem is obviously with the benefits which are bestowed in a discriminating manner. Your logic is about the same as saying: Blacks shouldn't be allowed to vote, because if they were allowed to, then you might have Asians pretending to be black and voting as well.
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#8
11-21-2007, 12:18 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
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Your logic is about the same as saying: Blacks shouldn't be allowed to vote, because if they were allowed to, then you might have Asians pretending to be black and voting as well. [/ QUOTE ] So you don't believe Asians should have the right to vote? I see...
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#9
11-21-2007, 12:27 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
Sadly, your opinion on where those lines are to be drawn goes against a vast majority of the rest of the public. [/ QUOTE ] The vast majority are pro polygamy? Second, why is it "Sad" that his opinion is different then the vast public? Is the opinions of the vast public significant? The vast public believes in UFOs... are they real? America's Funniest Home Videos was in the top 10 for several years when it was on... does that mean its the pinnacle of television? Is it your contention that opinions are more important then any overlying rational philosophy? [ QUOTE ] You did a fantastic job supporting that opinion. [/ QUOTE ] This is sheer irony. You're the guy who thinks his opinion is more important then the results of any studies. You seem to think your opinion is evidence enough... [ QUOTE ] This might not be true for women, but I wholeheartedly believe that if men were legally allowed to marry other men, you'd see bachelors snatching up $12 marriage licenses left and right and entering into legal contracts with other bachelor friends for the tax benefits. Now, you have to consider what that would do to private benefit packages offered by employers. [/ QUOTE ] Wow. You 'wholeheartedly believe it'?!?!? then it must be true. Enough said. [ QUOTE ] If I'm single and my best friend is a government employee, what's stopping me from paying my $12 for our marriage license so I can get put on to his healthcare plan? [/ QUOTE ] Nothing. I support you. Marry any dude you want. Meanwhile I suspect most men will hold out to find a woman they want to marry and gay guys will wait to find partners they want to spend their life with. But if you want to live with some dude to share his benefits good for you.
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#10
11-21-2007, 12:39 PM
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Re: my solution to the gay marriage argument
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] If I'm single and my best friend is a government employee, what's stopping me from paying my $12 for our marriage license so I can get put on to his healthcare plan? [/ QUOTE ] Nothing. I support you. Marry any dude you want. Meanwhile I suspect most men will hold out to find a woman they want to marry and gay guys will wait to find partners they want to spend their life with. But if you want to live with some dude to share his benefits good for you. [/ QUOTE ] And this is where our true disconnect lies. I don't believe the government should be inflated even further so as to suck more money out of me. You do. You = liberal = high taxes and a nanny state Me = conservative = low taxes and a gov't that leaves me the [censored] alone Edit: If you want to set up your gay lover to be your PoA and put him on your private health insurance plan and every other thing under the sun, I have NO problem with that. When you start proposing bigger government just because you feel left out, THAT is where I start having a problem.
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Hybrid Mode
