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#1
11-10-2007, 03:17 PM
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Re: Chomsky on Anarchism (sidenote; education)
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] tame, [ QUOTE ] But anyway, you don't think it would work at all and I don't think it would work for a group of more than say 30-40 people max. So I don't think we disagree much here. [/ QUOTE ] And yet it has worked reasonably well for 50 years in a corporation with up to 75,000 employees: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mondrag...ve_Corporation [/ QUOTE ] In no way is a company that receives special tax incentives an example of AC. [/ QUOTE ] This isn't about AC. [/ QUOTE ] Fine, it isnt an example of Anarcho-anything [/ QUOTE ] Sure it is. It is a valid example of anarcho-syndicalistic principle, which is a very different ideology from anarcho-capitalism. [/ QUOTE ] It cant be anarcho anything because it is receiving subsidies from a GOVERNMENT 
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#2
11-11-2007, 10:49 AM
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Re: Chomsky on Anarchism (sidenote; education)
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] tame, [ QUOTE ] But anyway, you don't think it would work at all and I don't think it would work for a group of more than say 30-40 people max. So I don't think we disagree much here. [/ QUOTE ] And yet it has worked reasonably well for 50 years in a corporation with up to 75,000 employees: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mondrag...ve_Corporation [/ QUOTE ] In no way is a company that receives special tax incentives an example of AC. [/ QUOTE ] This isn't about AC. [/ QUOTE ] Fine, it isnt an example of Anarcho-anything [/ QUOTE ] Sure it is. It is a valid example of anarcho-syndicalistic principle, which is a very different ideology from anarcho-capitalism. [/ QUOTE ] It cant be anarcho anything because it is receiving subsidies from a GOVERNMENT [/ QUOTE ] Nothing is perfect. Only fanatic idealists think they can make stuff work perfectly by the book. Its still a good example. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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#3
11-11-2007, 05:38 PM
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Re: Chomsky on Anarchism (sidenote; education)
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The world runs on morality. Most people pay their taxes because they think it's good to do so. Either that or fear but the guns can only intimidate so many without the underlying false morality they are nothing. Why do you think the government comes up with all this bulls**t about the poor and the environment and blah blah blah if they could just say we've got nukes give us your cash now. Convincing people that taxation is evil is the best thing anyone can do for the world. [/ QUOTE ] Obviously I agree with you, I just find it fascinating that you ACists have no problem with enforcing this morality on others (saying without this morality we are screwed). To others who attempt the same, you refuse it on general principle.
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#4
11-11-2007, 05:45 PM
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Re: Chomsky on Anarchism (sidenote; education)
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] The world runs on morality. Most people pay their taxes because they think it's good to do so. Either that or fear but the guns can only intimidate so many without the underlying false morality they are nothing. Why do you think the government comes up with all this bulls**t about the poor and the environment and blah blah blah if they could just say we've got nukes give us your cash now. Convincing people that taxation is evil is the best thing anyone can do for the world. [/ QUOTE ] Obviously I agree with you, I just find it fascinating that you ACists have no problem with enforcing this morality on others (saying without this morality we are screwed). To others who attempt the same, you refuse it on general principle. [/ QUOTE ] I'm not enforcing morality, I'm just asking people to enact their own stated morality. If you say stealing is wrong act as if stealing is wrong. If statists and governments just said we're bigger and stronger than you so give us your money then I wouldn't have a problem with the message (though obviously I'd disagree with the action) but the fact that they moralize but don't live up to their own stated morals is the real problem. stealing is wrong, it is moral pay your taxes. Logically only one of these statements can be true. I just want people to pick a side and declare themselves honestly. Is the initiation of violence good or bad? If it bad it's bad for everyone if it's good it's good for everyone there are no special classes of people.
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#5
11-11-2007, 05:50 PM
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Re: Chomsky on Anarchism (sidenote; education)
[ QUOTE ]
I'm not enforcing morality, I'm just asking people to enact their own stated morality. If you say stealing is wrong act as if stealing is wrong. If statists and governments just said we're bigger and stronger than you so give us your money then I wouldn't have a problem with the message (though obviously I'd disagree with the action) but the fact that they moralize but don't live up to their own stated morals is the real problem. stealing is wrong, it is moral pay your taxes. Logically only one of these statements can be true. I just want people to pick a side and declare themselves honestly. Is the initiation of violence good or bad? If it bad it's bad for everyone if it's good it's good for everyone there are no special classes of people. [/ QUOTE ] I obviously have no problem whatsoever with the initiation of violence in punishment of certain actions. Anybody who disagrees is a fool.
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#6
11-11-2007, 05:52 PM
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Re: Chomsky on Anarchism (sidenote; education)
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I'm not enforcing morality, I'm just asking people to enact their own stated morality. If you say stealing is wrong act as if stealing is wrong. If statists and governments just said we're bigger and stronger than you so give us your money then I wouldn't have a problem with the message (though obviously I'd disagree with the action) but the fact that they moralize but don't live up to their own stated morals is the real problem. stealing is wrong, it is moral pay your taxes. Logically only one of these statements can be true. I just want people to pick a side and declare themselves honestly. Is the initiation of violence good or bad? If it bad it's bad for everyone if it's good it's good for everyone there are no special classes of people. [/ QUOTE ] I obviously have no problem whatsoever with the initiation of violence in punishment of certain actions. Anybody who disagrees is a fool. [/ QUOTE ] If it's in punishment for actions it's not initiation doucy?
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#7
11-11-2007, 06:23 PM
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Re: Chomsky on Anarchism (sidenote; education)
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] I'm not enforcing morality, I'm just asking people to enact their own stated morality. If you say stealing is wrong act as if stealing is wrong. If statists and governments just said we're bigger and stronger than you so give us your money then I wouldn't have a problem with the message (though obviously I'd disagree with the action) but the fact that they moralize but don't live up to their own stated morals is the real problem. stealing is wrong, it is moral pay your taxes. Logically only one of these statements can be true. I just want people to pick a side and declare themselves honestly. Is the initiation of violence good or bad? If it bad it's bad for everyone if it's good it's good for everyone there are no special classes of people. [/ QUOTE ] I obviously have no problem whatsoever with the initiation of violence in punishment of certain actions. Anybody who disagrees is a fool. [/ QUOTE ] If it's in punishment for actions it's not initiation doucy? [/ QUOTE ] What sort of actions qualify for being met with violence then? And if you say "violent", I'd like you to define it.
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