The Myth of Meaning

[pokervintage]

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Just because some people believe there is a God doesn't make it real.

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Of course it does. When a person believes something is true then it is true for him. Yes for a child the truth fairy exists. That is what believe means. That is not to say that a person cannot change their views. But as long as they believe something is true then for them it is true. My gosh that is exatly what religion is based on. Belief (without proof).

pokervintage

[luckyme]

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Of course it does. When a person believes something is true then it is true for him. Yes for a child the truth fairy exists. That is what believe means.

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And just as the dollar doesn't actually come from the tooth fairy, so the 'meaning' isn't actually coming from god. It's coming from the belief in god.
"My belief in gods existence gives meaning to my life"
isn't under question.
"How does the existence of god give meaning to human life" is.

luckyme

[kurto]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Just because some people believe there is a God doesn't make it real.

[/ QUOTE ]

Of course it does. When a person believes something is true then it is true for him. Yes for a child the truth fairy exists. That is what believe means. That is not to say that a person cannot change their views. But as long as they believe something is true then for them it is true. My gosh that is exatly what religion is based on. Belief (without proof).

pokervintage

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There's some confusion here.

Certainly if something believes something to be real, it 'seems' real to them. That does not mean it is real.

Hence the example I gave earlier about the Christian and the Lion. Recently, I believe in Europe, A Christian jumped into a lion's cage because he believed God would protect him. It seemed real to him. Yet, he was killed by the lion.

My point, obviously, is that just because something seems real to someone does not make it, in fact, reality.

In the context of this thread... if what you're saying is that someone can draw 'meaning' from something merely by believing in it, regardless of its truth, I agree with you. A placebo effect.

I am merely trying to separate 'reality' from 'belief.' They are not the same.

[pokervintage]

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There's some confusion here.

Certainly if something believes something to be real, it 'seems' real to them. That does not mean it is real.


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Look when someone believes something is true it is true for them until they are shown otherwise and accept the other point of view. Why is it that for people that believe in God, God exists? It is for no other reason than that they believe.

That is not hard to grasp or understand and is not confusing. You want to argue that because God exists for them doesn't mean he xists for you and you are right. God does not exist for you. But he does exist for true believers. You want to argue the existence of God...good luck.

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Hence the example I gave earlier about the Christian and the Lion. Recently, I believe in Europe, A Christian jumped into a lion's cage because he believed God would protect him. It seemed real to him. Yet, he was killed by the lion.


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The answer to this is that "we do not question God's wisdom or reason for doing things" Perhaps God did protect the Christian by making him not suffer or bringing him to heaven after his death. There might be many expalnations for the death not countering the belief that the christian was being protected.

pokervintage

[kurto]

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Look when someone believes something is true it is true for them until they are shown otherwise..

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Perhaps we are arguing apples and oranges. You are not differentiating between "it is true for them" and "reality." The word for what your describing is "delusion."

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A delusion is an unshakable belief in something untrue.

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Let's take a specific God.... Zeus. In reality, he either exists or he does not. Whether or not you believe in him has no bearing on the truth of the matter.

All you're saying is 'people believe what they believe'... fine. We both agree. What is NOT right is WHAT PEOPLE BELIEVE=REALITY.

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The answer to this is that "we do not question God's wisdom or reason for doing things" Perhaps God did protect the Christian by making him not suffer or bringing him to heaven after his death. There might be many expalnations for the death not countering the belief that the christian was being protected.


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But you're contradicting yourself. You are asserting that if someone believes in something then it is real. If believing something made it real, then simply believing the lion would not hurt him would have to mean the lion would not hurt him.

He was delusional. His beliefs did not reflect reality. I believe you're playing semantics trying to salvage the lion story when, clearly the man thought the lion wasn't going to kill him.