100PLO: AAxx out of position

jpg7n16 · #1 09-29-2007, 01:22 AM

Button is 50/22/3.4 over 50 or so hands. Button and I do have history where he c/r-ed me the first time I 3-bet him and then made some remark in the chat about "hard to fold aces isn't it." And I have raised him off a couple pots since.

UTG is very passive. Rarely ever raising. And is not capable of folding the 2nd nut flush. I know this because two hands earlier, button bet the flop ($10) and I raised my flopped 3rd nut flush ($30) and UTG went in w/ the 2nd nut flush ($47). Hence his stack size. 70/4.8/.95 over 100 hands.

Reraise pre was to make it look like I was beginning to 3bet w/o AAxx.

PokerStars Pot-Limit Omaha High, $1.00 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

UTG ($105.10)
MP ($103.80)
CO ($39.25)
Button ($160.15)
Hero ($118.50)
BB ($30.50)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls $1, 2 folds, Button raises to $4, Hero raises to $10, 1 fold, UTG calls $9, Button calls $6.

Flop: ($31) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero bets $20, UTG calls $20, Button folds.

Turn: ($71) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $30, UTG raises to $75.1, Hero calls $45.10.

River: ($221.20) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)

Final Pot: $221.20

chucky · #2 09-29-2007, 02:20 AM

I dont understand your turn bet. Yes villian could have 2 nfd but he would not raise or bet that. I would either pot turn or check/fold. You are looking at kqj2 or something similar from villian.

Burdzthewurd · #3 09-29-2007, 04:24 AM

I think 99xx is more likely than 2xxx but I'd just pot flop and shove turn here, next time slam an Ace on river.

Elrazor · #4 09-29-2007, 04:53 AM

is he bad enough to chase a non-nut flush on a paired board?? i think against these types of villan i c/f the turn - if i check turn and someone who has called a c/bet with a total a/f of less than 1 bets i know im in trouble - i can easily put him on JJ72 or 9933 in this spot with his stats

SteveL91 · #5 09-29-2007, 04:59 AM

I don't like your bet-size on the turn if you're planning on calling the push against someone you've described. If you were HU with the button on the turn, I think it would be fine, but not UTG.

jpg7n16 · #6 09-29-2007, 09:52 PM

Why does everyone always advocate betting as large as possible on the turn? Am I not understanding something?

So, my goal is to get him to put in more money w/ a worse hand, right?. If I pot it, can he continue w/ QQxx no clubs or a low flush draw? Would he think I was weak and play back w/ top pair and overs? No, he'd prob just fold cause it's too much money.

PSB gets played back at by 2xxx or better, weak gets played by 2xxx+ and maybe some other hands too (which can include lower flush draws that may even be drawing dead). I'm committed either way (PSB or weaker bet), so why would I want to blast out every hand that I'm beating? Or am I just being too optimistic and fooling myself into thinking it's even worth continuing?

And if he only flat calls w/ a 2 on this flop, why would I even want to pot the turn? <- hence my post. does anyone ever not get shown a duece here enough to bother continuing on the turn? (take a wild guess what he had) [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

SteveL91 · #7 09-29-2007, 11:26 PM

I think you're really over-estimating how often someone will play back at you on the turn, especially given the pot size relative to the stacks. If someone was going to play back at you, they would have done it on the flop while they might have had some fold equity. Basically, when someone you think is very passive shoves on you on this turn, he doesn't have a worse FD; he doesn't have a bare overpair and he isn't on a pure bluff: if you're lucky, he just has a bare 2, but more often than not, he'll already be at least full. This is just about always a pure value play. Every now and then, of course you'll run into an overpair & FD or something stupid, but I don't think that'll happen too often.

Again, against the button, I wouldn't have a problem with it, but I think you've over-estimating how often your hand is still actually good against UTG, since you're not quite getting odds to draw to the flush itself.

iggymcfly · #8 09-30-2007, 02:53 AM

[ QUOTE ]
So, my goal is to get him to put in more money w/ a worse hand, right?

[/ QUOTE ]

You're definitely on the right track here. However, your underapplying the principle. The correct way to actually get people to put money in behind here is to check the flop. A weak flush draw or overpair will often try to take the pot down here and at the very least, you can keep a flush draw in that could have folded to a flop bet.

On this board, if your opponents are behind, they'll usually have about 4 outs max to outdraw you and you really don't mind giving a free card. I know it's counterintuitive since you usually want to shove, shove, shove, your made hands in PLO but in this case, you're a lot better off playing passively on the paired board.