$22 Party, 14BB stack, KJ in BB, facing miniraise

[ouwep]

Hello,

Can I call here? Or is folding/pushing better...

Party Poker
No Limit Holdem Tournament
Blinds: t100/t200
8 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: t1960
UTG+1: t2380
MP1: t3950
MP2: t2720
CO: t3580
Button: t2540
SB: t1380
Hero: t1490

Pre-flop: (8 players) Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
3 folds, <font color="#cc0000">MP2 raises to t400</font>, CO folds, Button calls t400 <font color="aaaaaa">(pot was t700)</font>, SB folds, Hero calls t200 <font color="aaaaaa">(pot was t1100)</font>.

Greets,

Wessel

[sbj]

[ QUOTE ]
Hello,

Can I call here? Or is folding/pushing better...

Party Poker
No Limit Holdem Tournament
Blinds: t100/t200
8 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: t1960
UTG+1: t2380
MP1: t3950
MP2: t2720
CO: t3580
Button: t2540
SB: t1380
Hero: t1490

Pre-flop: (8 players) Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
3 folds, <font color="#cc0000">MP2 raises to t400</font>, CO folds, Button calls t400 <font color="aaaaaa">(pot was t700)</font>, SB folds, Hero calls t200 <font color="aaaaaa">(pot was t1100)</font>.

Greets,

Wessel

[/ QUOTE ]

This is an odd spot. The problem is obviously that you are a short stack which complicates it for two reasons.
1) A call leaves you with only 1000 chips and you'll be the SB next hand which most likely leaves you with 900 chips. Thus if you call and don't hit, you'll have less than 5X BB, not an unreceoverable position but not a good one. You will also be out of position in any future betting rounds of this hand.

2) A push will have little fold equity. If you push, the pot is 2300 and it will cost MP1 1000 to call and since he was initial raiser, he is likely to call or overpush. If he simply calls, then Button needs to pay 1000 into a 3300 pot so there is reasonable chance he calls.


However, you are still getting 4.5 to 1 on your call.

Because I don't think pusing is good, we either call or fold. I think I fold, due to position and the lackluster strnegth of the hand.

[Scotty_12]

I probably fold and call if its suited ... hopefully we can shove BVB or from the button next hand to get back up to 1490 ... this isnt a strong hand and our position sucks also

[DevinLake]

I'd fold despite the rediculous odds. That 200 is very valuable to your stack. You should have very little fold equity to shove here. So, you should be ahead of MP's riasing range to shove here. That depends on reads.

Calling is reasonable though with the odds. But, it's a large percentage of your stack when you are going to mis 70% of the flops.

[Q..]

Interesting spot, i think call has more ev then fold though, and push is bad for sure. 1:4.5 pot odds and 30% to hit flop with implied odds of further betting, since their range is pretty wide i guess, so we cant assume our J or K would be dominated if we hit, justify it. A read or two could be good though - if they are looser then normal this is a clear call,if they are tighter this might be a more clear fold.
And i also think that this call has more ev then push from button after folding this, even possibility of that push is slim, and that push wont have much of FE either.

[ouwep]

Thanks everyone!

If I understand it well: folding and calling are both fine (i.e. not a big leak), but better then pushing.

fold = call &gt; push.

But if I had more stack, let's say t3000. What then?

call &gt; fold &gt; push?

And if I had a smaller stack (t1000), then it is a clear fold right?

[mortimo]

I fold with this stack. Maybe with a 3k-stack or more.

[jaydreb]

I probably fold in this spot, but wouldn't be shocked if calling turned out to be better.

[acebond]

with that stack, out of position i think i would fold... but i might not be in my league over here

[HajiShirazu]

I would call an all in in this spot if the all-in was a minraise even if they turned over a hand that I was 30% to win against. I think this is a better spot to gamble than that so it should be right to call, even if it does seem a little bad to call off 1/6 of your stack when you are so short already.