Noob question about combo draws

[Craggoo]

Im a little drunk but this is a clear hand where you put in as many bets and raises as the donk will let you. This bet on the flop screams AJ-QJ which I *think* we're a favorite against. if hes willing to felt that little then make a note and valuebet him to death afterwards.

[Spurious]

shoving is a coinflip here, and most people dont fold J and an overcard here.

I think most people advice shoving didnt think about it.
You can put in a little raise, to something like 7, but dont shove here, it is a bad play.


Imo, i think shoving the flop with a combodraw is bad poker. You wont get called by too many hands that would make this play highly profitable.

Raise here to 6-7$ and reevaluate.

[Spurious]

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I switch it up between raising the flop and shoving pretty much any turn and just calling down depending on bet sizes. You have position, there is a lot different stuff you can do here. How you play a draw is dependent on what type of villain you are facing, there is no one particular way to do it.

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agreed. if he will regularly get all in with top pair, like a KJ type hand, and you know this, i think it's totally cool to get all in on the flop if possible. well, it's profitablet to do so. if he has KJ, you're about a 58% favorite to win, and even if he has one of your cards discounted (AJ), you're still a 55% favorite.

i think that raising here is the right move no matter what. if he pushes over your raise, you hellmuth call. if you flat call the flop and hit an A or a Q (assuming he doesn't have either of those if he has a J), he's going to slow down. so in these situations you need to get as much money in "good" (odds wise) as you can before you hit an A or a Q (if they are live and win it for you) and he slows down. or even a club or a K for that matter.

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You are only a 60:40 favorite over KJ with without clubs, if he got clubs it becomes even worse, and if he got one of your overs with a club, you are in even worse shape.

[Craggoo]

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shoving is a coinflip here, and most people dont fold J and an overcard here.

I think most people advice shoving didnt think about it.
You can put in a little raise, to something like 7, but dont shove here, it is a bad play.


Imo, i think shoving the flop with a combodraw is bad poker. You wont get called by too many hands that would make this play highly profitable.

Raise here to 6-7$ and reevaluate.

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I dont believe anyone here is advocating straight out shoving his flop bet, but if the donk gives you the opportunity to 4 bet all-in on the flop you take it. Amirite?

[JH1]

Spurious, just a quick question about when you're figuring out EV. I haven't ever discounted my flush cards that other players could have when figuring out odds, is this normal to do (I am not trying to be a jerk here, I am seriously asking)? Because I've often thought about what if 1/2 my flush cards are already in the muck, but I have no way of knowing so I just included them anyways. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[JH1]

And I'm really fine w/ KJ calling. As BK said before I'm going to be a coinflip at worst (of course I drop to around 40% vs a set I believe) but against most of his range I'm at least 50-60%. Add in my fold equity and I'm a big favorite.

Still agree with you on raising the flop, but not shoving.

[Spurious]

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Spurious, just a quick question about when you're figuring out EV. I haven't ever discounted my flush cards that other players could have when figuring out odds, is this normal to do (I am not trying to be a jerk here, I am seriously asking)? Because I've often thought about what if 1/2 my flush cards are already in the muck, but I have no way of knowing so I just included them anyways. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

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You dont discount your flushcards, which are in the muck already, but if you figure out your equity, and you know you opponents hand ofc you discount.

I talked about discounting one out, because i dont think we are a big favorite here most of the time, and i listed all the possible hands he could have.

[JH1]

ok thanks for clarifying that for me.