Fun w/ A5s

[The Dude]

I'm expecting this guy to have check-raised a pair on the flop, so even though he sees that turn card as a great card to bluff with, I'm pretty sure it didn't help him. He could have something like 22 or A3, but I think a flush draw, T9, T8, or A5 or A4 makes up a large percentage of his range.

So given that range, that river card sucks balls. But I am getting 10.5:1 to call. Sometimes I don't know quite what to do when I had decided to call down but the board gets worse. It's not like every draw possible just got there, but a whole lot of them did.

[The Dude]

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I'd just check the turn. I don't think that a bet will pick it up enough to compensate for the times that you have to pay 2 bets to draw to your many outs. The six pairing seems like it is going to encourage calls from the other two players.

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Huh? I didn't get check-raised on the flop, which means my opponents will have hands like JT and K9 much more often than a pair. The 6, aside from an A or a 4 is a pretty good card for me, even without the flush draw. Why would I check and give them a free card? I have no reason to think I'm behind here.

[cgrohman]

And even if you are behind you have a great draw. I never check this turn.

[n.s.]

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I'd just check the turn. I don't think that a bet will pick it up enough to compensate for the times that you have to pay 2 bets to draw to your many outs. The six pairing seems like it is going to encourage calls from the other two players.

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Huh? I didn't get check-raised on the flop, which means my opponents will have hands like JT and K9 much more often than a pair. The 6, aside from an A or a 4 is a pretty good card for me, even without the flush draw. Why would I check and give them a free card? I have no reason to think I'm behind here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, you described the limper as "very loose, passive, and bad", which makes me think that he would often check-call a pair on the flop. The read on the SB is less specific, but I also thought that he might check-call the flop, especially if he flopped a big hand (you said he makes some bad slowplays). Finally, while I agree that you are often still good, your flush draw means that an opponent with overcards might only have 4 outs to draw out on you, so you aren't necessarily giving up on the hand if you don't improve on the river.

That was my thinking, anyways. The more I think about it, though, getting your opponents to fold a culmative 8-12 outs is pretty important, so a bet is probably best after all.

[Garland]

There's an old saying: You can raise with any two cards, but if you're calling you probably have a hand. When he calls the flop on a rainbow board, what does he have? Sure he could have a gutshot I guess, but you're going to be shown a 6 a big percent of the time. Perhaps a slowplayed straight. 89 just got there.

From prior play is he likely to check-raise the field with 2nd pair? I'm guessing not from cold description.

I like the play in all streets except the river. It's a bad spot to call. In fact raising is better than calling, but folding is probably best.

Garland

[chesspain]

I hate both the turn bet and the river call.

[Hobbs.]

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I hate both the turn bet and the river call.

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ick, how can you not like the turn bet?

[BigBadBabar]

i think the turn bet is fine but i fold the river.

[The Dude]

Okay. When there's one limper and the CO raises, it's no secret that CO's hand doesn't have to be great. SB knows that. So why, if he has a pair on the flop, would he not check-raise it? I'm certainly expecting to see him raise any 7 or 6 he might have, unless it's a flopped monster, like a set or a straight.

I didn't have a specific read on him this and that said "he's got a bluff," I just figured if he had anything he would have raised the flop. At least often enough to justify calling down. I'm certain the decision on the turn to call down is correct.

What I don't know is if there are enough hands he could have that didn't get there on the river. The T is one of the worst cards in the deck for me. And this is the situation where I sometimes find myself not knowing what to do.

[ship it pls]

i 3-bet turn a lot here, unless villain is passive - the 6 is a great card, i never check it... i like every street, river included (but i fold occassionally)