Poker In Colorado?

[mr.bum]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
correct me if im wrong, but i thought both the loge/ameristar had jackpots...the 5-5 dealers choice sounds like it would be the diamond in the ruff that is blackhawk.i get tilted just thinking about 2-5 and 5-5 holdem. (i probably am just awful at spread limit holdem, but that game feels like u r beating ur head against a wall most of the time)what part of CO are u from RR?

[/ QUOTE ]

Black Hawk.

[/ QUOTE ]
actualy i just got a pm on this very subject. ur a floor at the gilpen? u should def include that as a disclaimer when advising people to go there. i have sat there and watched people tip a min of 2$ every single pot.what do ur dealer pull in on tips?i discussed this with a women who previously delt in black hawk but now works in vegas and she 100%agreed that she much much more in black hawk.RR in your honest opinion is 2-5 spread(holdem) beatable in blackhawk? if u have what is you win rate and sample size bb/hr plz.i would guess that around 230 dollars leaves the table every hour on any given night...but again u would know better than me. how much would u say is flying off the table?

[/ QUOTE ]

I cannot discuss how much leaves the table. I would consider Black Hawk the best market in the country to deal in. I would have to say the 2-5 is very beatable. The rake is not as heavy in some markets and it plays much larger than a 3-6 game. I haven't been here long at all so I do not have significant personal records, but knowing games that play smaller with a larger amount coming off the table I know the games have to be beatable. I have not had a losing session yet in Black Hawk, but I have only played here 5 times. I don't know if there are any games up here besides our 5-5 choice that do not have a bad beat; I am not overly concerned with what other casinos are doing. As far as providing a disclaimer I think that would be excessive advertising as I am sure any regular readers of this forum would say that any poker room I am involved with is going to be better than the ones down the street.

[/ QUOTE ]
i am well aware that the caliber of play is as bad as it gets.i have beaten SS nl online over 100k hands...this is far from a brag. i would guess that anyone who could do this would be one of the best players at any given holdem table in bh.over 50 session in bh im a either a break even or a very very small winner. when u say "very beatable" im sure u have seen actual evidence of this then. so whos records did u see? what was there win rate like? or do u just assume that the 70+year old social security props are making money because its their only form of social interaction?
i think this is just a math prob anyway. so i will post the game/rake/tip in theory and see what the numbers people think.imo the amount people tip is important. 6 way caped pot to the river...guy rivers trip 3s takes down a monster with a standard 2 outer and then begins to throw chips at the dealer like they control the outcome. this happens at least once a lap there.

[Tony Tone]

As far as live action I think the only way you can turn a profit in a 2-5 game is to build pots for when you make hands and knowing when to save bets when you are beat. I definitely think you can beat the 5-5 Choice game with ease though if you have any clue what is going on.

[JackInDaCrak]

I'm ahead in the 2-5 game over the last few years. Stop playing top pair so [censored] hard you donkeys.

[RR]

[ QUOTE ]
RR,
If you reply with the standard "prove it" or "this is hard to prove" - I will respond with a laundry list of examples. So please lets not waste eachothers time!

I, and many others, simply don't play there anymore because of this... but I still stand by my accusation.

[img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

Typically when this sort of accusation is made they claim that they are trying to trap people in the middle etc. If someone attempts to collude in this manner it just won't be effective because they are laying 2:1 (or more if you think they are raising more than 2 ways). What successful colluders do is play best hand play best hand and fold hands they otherwise wouldn't rather than lay odds to their opponents. If you have some specific examples I would be happy to look at them, but in almost every case of these allegations they are made by people that hate variance that think when people start raising because it is fun they must be colluding.

[JoshM]

ill post my figures, for whatever its worth...
i've played 200 hours at 2-5 spread in blackhawk mostly at the lodge and central station, spread over 4 years.
Im up $200 in 2-5 (after dealer tips), 1 whopping dollar per hour.
ive played 15 tournements (half 3 table half 5 table) there and am up $300 after tip. (i prefer cash for learning)
most meals and drinks are comped, so after travel gas and waitress tips, which i dont track, im guessing im down a small amount.
that being said... i consider all my time in blackhawk dedicated to learning. I don't draw any conclusions about my level of play from this post, just giving up some numbers for conversation.
josh

[Ultra Violet]

I'm definitely not an expert on the topic, but I am a winning playing in Black Hawk (and the few times I played in Vegas), but it is hard to beat the rake at lower limits. Plus, I'm not a fan of the bad beat jackpots because it feels like being forced to buy a lottery ticket any time I win the pot. (And, I do think the "what if" mentality can influence people to play cards they would never ordinarily play.) I prefer to play tournaments but I have been playing more and more cash games because I can usually make my tourney buy-ins and help my bottom line.

That said, my two favorite places to play are the Gilpin and the Ameristar. While I love the dealers at the Gilpin, the cash games at the Ameristar always seem to be juicier for me. Just like anywhere else, you need to feel out your table after you first sit down and ease your way into the game. It can vary by time of day, day of the week, etc, but after trying out each room at different times and different days, I think you can find one or two that suit your style and will be profitable for you.

You can generalize some of the rooms and say that players at Casino A are all rocks Casinos B + C are all maniacs, but you can't really judge a game until you sit down and observe for a round. Some tables are filled with recreational players playing for entertainment and constantly rebuying. Some tables are filled with more familiar faces and all you do is pass a few chips around the table until they are raked away. If a table isn't going your way, you can always try to get a table change, take a 30 minute break, or even pop over to a new poker room. All the rooms in Central City and Black Hawk are just a few minutes apart.

Depending on the time of day and day of week, you can sit down at a $2-5 rock-tight table and have another $2-5 table right behind you that reraises every hand. Your own personal style may prefer one over the other, but I think if you are patient and observant you can do well in either. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[NextinLine]

There is no variation in 2/5 games up the hill. I would much rather put money on FTP then drive the hour up and back. It's next to impossible to beat the 2 5 game with rake and donks involved.

[mr.bum]

[ QUOTE ]
There is no variation in 2/5 games up the hill. I would much rather put money on FTP then drive the hour up and back. It's next to impossible to beat the 2 5 game with rake and donks involved.

[/ QUOTE ]
this is the sort of advice i would expect from a mod.RR should post actual evidence of this game being "very beatable".RR do you know one person who is up there 4 plus nights a week and keeps simple records of wins and losses? saying "I have not had a losing session yet in Black Hawk, but I have only played here 5 times" is one of the most irresponsible, misleading statements i have ever herd.i did not think it was possible to mod this site and be unfamiliar with the concept of variance(how meaningful a massive 5 session sample is).ironic,because there is an overabundance of variance in BH. PLAY ONLINE. dont support this gross little town that is slowly sucking the life out of colorado's poker community.

[RR]

[ QUOTE ]
RR do you know one person who is up there 4 plus nights a week and keeps simple records of wins and losses? saying "I have not had a losing session yet in Black Hawk, but I have only played here 5 times"

[/ QUOTE ]

I do. And no I won't be getting the records and sharing them here becasue what people do in a casino is there business. You have to look at it logically; if a smaller game with a larger rake in another market is known to be beatable this game would have to be.

5 session is plenty for an experienced player to know if they have an edge. After you have been playing and know the game you don't need to use a statistical test to evaluate a game. The game existed long befor people were playing on-line and looking at large samples. If you cannot watch a game and determine if you would have an edge in that game you need to look for smaller games. And I don't think you will find any mod on this site that would say bad players make the game harder to beat. This is just another version of "I need to play higher so they will respect my raises."

[*TT*]

[ QUOTE ]

They sit there and talk in their language with each other, sometimes even with the dealers themselves, and when we try to get the rule of 'English only' enforced, normally all it draws is shrugged shoulders from the floor staff.

[/ QUOTE ]

they are allowed to do this as long as there is no hand taking place, there is no rule (usually) about people talking in a foreign language in between hands.

[ QUOTE ]
I truly HATE living in Colorado because the poker sucks sooo badly! [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

I'm looking for every opportunity to be rid of this place, and move someplace where I can play REAL poker on a regular basis.

[/ QUOTE ]

Move up to a limit where they respect your raises. And yes, I am dissing you for saying that.