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#21
09-07-2007, 08:43 PM
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Re: 50 NL - T9s with flush draw and top pair on flop -- standard?
gotta check the flop in the 3bet flop there. he's just cant wait to c/r us. take a free one.
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#22
09-07-2007, 08:46 PM
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Re: 50 NL - T9s with flush draw and top pair on flop -- standard?
[ QUOTE ]
gotta check the flop in the 3bet flop there. he's just cant wait to c/r us. take a free one. [/ QUOTE ] im glad to get it in against an overpair in this spot, it will show profit over the long term nearly every time (because of whats already in the pot, im aware that im a slight underdog)
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#23
09-07-2007, 08:47 PM
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Re: 50 NL - T9s with flush draw and top pair on flop -- standard?
[ QUOTE ]
the hand is no favorite over an overpair, as my stove shows [/ QUOTE ]Consider rake and there's no reason to flip right now, I think before he raises the range is slightly looser but he could very well c/f turn even if we miss. Probably going broke anyways if we spike and he has an overpair slowplaying.
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#25
09-07-2007, 08:55 PM
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Re: 50 NL - T9s with flush draw and top pair on flop -- standard?
I probably play it the same, although I don't think its perfect. It looks like he has an overpair almost always and if not that, AK of spades. Once you bet the flop and he c/r I don't see how you don't shove. I don't think a fold is correct. As played I think its fine, but then again I'm no expert.
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#26
09-07-2007, 09:00 PM
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Re: 50 NL - T9s with flush draw and top pair on flop -- standard?
All the people who are saying that betting the flop is ok because it's +ev are missing the point. We want maximal EV, not just borderline +ev
Checking is the way to go. Of course once you bet you need to shove
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#27
09-07-2007, 09:02 PM
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Re: 50 NL - T9s with flush draw and top pair on flop -- standard?
[ QUOTE ]
i wouldnt call my stack of with 22 preflop against AK, and some dead money in the pot. It is a marginal +EV play... [/ QUOTE ] if i knew 99% he had AK i would...but then again variance doesnt bother me if i know im playing well but i cant see passing +EV edges being good. i dont see how youre going to play it to get value out of this hand if you just check behind. what are you going to do when you check behind and he makes a big bet on a blank turn? just fold? i just cant see playing it passively being any good...you hit nearly the best flop you could want with your hand, i want some value...
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#28
09-07-2007, 09:03 PM
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Re: 50 NL - T9s with flush draw and top pair on flop -- standard?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] In a 3bet pot, I just check flop. His check has me slightly worried. If he does again on turn go ahead and bet because it looks like he's just giving up. Here I would be happy to take a free one. [/ QUOTE ] no nonno u can't do that because ur hand is a small favorite over aa/kk/qq which is basically his range but it won't be on the turn if he overbets which is very possible. [/ QUOTE ] the hand is no favorite over an overpair, as my stove shows [/ QUOTE ] Well arenīt we Mr "the glass is half empty". When I see a flop like this after this action I am pretty excited, because I am basically never behind, no matter what read I have of villain. Whereas if I have say QQ here, vs the wrong villain I am drawing to 2 outs 99% of the time. That means I can get it in on the flop every time with T9s and it will be +EV. I canīt make a mistake. But villain might show up with less than stellar holdings every once in a while. And I fold pf.
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#29
09-07-2007, 09:03 PM
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Re: 50 NL - T9s with flush draw and top pair on flop -- standard?
[ QUOTE ]
All the people who are saying that betting the flop is ok because it's +ev are missing the point. We want maximal EV, not just borderline +ev Checking is the way to go. Of course once you bet you need to shove [/ QUOTE ] i dont see how checking is maximizing our EV...we cant call a big bet.
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#30
09-07-2007, 09:03 PM
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Re: 50 NL - T9s with flush draw and top pair on flop -- standard?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] i wouldnt call my stack of with 22 preflop against AK, and some dead money in the pot. It is a marginal +EV play... [/ QUOTE ] if i knew 99% he had AK i would...but then again variance doesnt bother me if i know im playing well but i cant see passing +EV edges being good. i dont see how youre going to play it to get value out of this hand if you just check behind. what are you going to do when you check behind and he makes a big bet on a blank turn? just fold? i just cant see playing it passively being any good...you hit nearly the best flop you could want with your hand, i want some value... [/ QUOTE ] If he bets the turn, you'll be getting direct odds to call. If you hit the river you get his whole stack, and all you paid was one bet Edit-- Not direct odds, it's 4:1 Edit2-- Actually its 4:1 against an overpair, much closer if you put AK into his range
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