Why do Americans work so much?

[good2cu]

Theards like this really put into prespective how good high-stakes online pros have it. I truly feel very lucky.

[jjshabado]

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As far as $1,610 per week coming out to 80K or so a year, well, the thing about freelance work is that one doesn't work 50 weeks a year. Frankly, I am so drained after 3-5 months on a movie that I can't imagine doing it 50 weeks a year. No time to sleep, to see friends and family, to exercise. So most years crews work a lot less days/weeks. Additionally, we have the constant specter of one union or another going on strike and we all being sol. Additionally, Los Angeles is a pricey place to live.


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I don't think you realize how much $1600/week is. I'm making $1500/week before taxes in New York and I'm definitely doing more than alright. Sure I don't work nearly as many hours most weeks but its a decent wage.

Bsically if you're whining about how tough a job $1600/week is you're out of touch with reality. Sure its not 50 weeks a year, but then how can you complain about having to work so hard? Its either an 80 grand/year job with really long hours (which isn't great, but is certainly better than most people) or its a 40 grand/year job with 6 months vacation (which isn't great, but is certainly better than most people).

Seriously, the jobs not that bad.

[Blarg]

How many hours a week do you work to get that $1,500 a week? That's only $78k, if you worked every week, which is a nice enough job. But if you are working 60 and 70 and 80 hours a week compared to 40 and 50, it works out to substantially less pay for your time. And that ignores that you cannot really pay for time, in that you can't get it back. Maybe not a big deal for a single person with no real interests or other obligations, but it makes it tough for people to maintain families and relationships. And if you're one of those single guys who doesn't want to be single anymore, or forever, or while the people you know outside of work are all living lives with somebody in them instead of just working, sleeping, and doing laundry, then you'll find it a lot harder to meet people and help a relationship get established when you have very little time to do it in. Most people want a partner who's actually around, otherwise it's a lot like being alone.

As to her job not being that bad, she loves it so I'm sure she agrees on the whole. But just like you're well aware of the good points, or at least should be, the bad points are there too and can be pretty striking.

One thing I note is that some of these jobs are really bad for your health. It's just not healthy to work 70 or 80 hours a week and up. It leads to high blood pressure, weight problems, and very often that kind of thing provides the perfect staging ground for developing drug or alcohol addictions, because it's such an unnatural way to live that people scramble to cope with.

[SEABEAST]

really great posts blarg, this in particular hit me pretty hard when i realised i felt exactly the same as you described, as a (male) professional poker player

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she needs adult interests. Not just raising kids; it's not stimulating enough. She needs interests she can share with other high-functioning adults who are also in the process of constantly learning intellectually difficult new things. Going to classes of some sort, developing compelling hobbies or intellectual interests, working toward a degree -- these are probably necessary for most adults to be happy. They need adult-level mental participation in society, and adult-level intellectual or career-based goals. All respect for motherhood aside, helping Johnny grow up full of self-esteem is a wonderful thing, and may be demanding in its own way, but it is far from hard core mental stimulus. Despite its rewards, it can be a very emotionally and spiritually stressful dead-end for a lot of women.

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"adult level mental participation in society"... "despite its rewards it can be a very emotionally and spiritually stressful dead-end"... these points in particular really summed up what i have been feeling and yearning for despite all of my "success". 25 really feels like too old to be doing the poker thing, despite the fact that most people i know are jealous of the position i am in. obviously it's very different on the surface to being a housewife, but it shares the focus on setting up and taking care of the future, rather than growing as a person, now.

[diamonddawg]

Blarg, ty for READING my post. I want to respond to a few things:

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How many hours a week do you work to get that $1,500 a week?

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Without the silly commute that most ppl in LA have to make of +/- 2 hours a day, the thing about our workday in film is that you are “ON” most of the time. You don’t have a hey of a lot of “hangin’ out, surfin’ the intrawebs” time if you are below a certain point in the food chain.
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…that ignores that you cannot really pay for time, in that you can't get it back. Maybe not a big deal for a single person with no real interests or other obligations, but it makes it tough for people to maintain families and relationships.

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Every day at work, usually around the 12th hour there, I have a laugh with the very sweet, relatively attractive 50ish script supervisor lady and we say “gee, where did the last 2 months go?” and then I suck in my breath and try not to have a heart attack. Because I don’t want to wake up one day, 50ish and relatively attractive and a-effing-lone.

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One thing I note is that some of these jobs are really bad for your health. It's just not healthy to work 70 or 80 hours a week and up.

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When I am not working, I go to yoga, go to Tissu class, go to the beach. I eat, drink and sleep.
I was so stressed on the last film that I stopped eating (I developed a weird rash that would come out when I ATE); eventually I had to be treated for it. By the way, it was NOT anorexia – it was, well, just strange. Frankly, money means little when you feel like crapola.

In conclusion, one part of Seabeast’s post struck me as profound, that which was quoted from someone who said: “She needs…hard core mental stimulus” – isn’t that what all bright ppl want? And that, to me is the only disappointment of my chosen career: that though I do get to think smart and not just work hard, I end up working hard, which seems to me, not too smart.

[jjshabado]

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Blarg, ty for READING my post. I want to respond to a few things:

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I read your post. You whined about how tough of working conditions your crew has. You talked about how disgusting it is that they don't have better working conditions. Then you described a job thats better than 50% of the jobs out there.

[diamonddawg]

I didn't think I was whining as I was empathizing with other ppl. I know that I have a great job.
However, I do think that it is sadly American to work as many hours as many ppl (again, I live in fishbowl in my industry, I admit that!) do and to not get a chance to live life.
I appreciate your reminding me that I have a better job than many other honest, hard-working folks in the US, or for that matter, in my town. There are many days that I am ungrateful. ty.

[spartaninpr]

The only thing in life guaranteed to go up in value is time.That's what women have figured out.That's why they want it from us.I went to a cookout awhile back at a friends house.He and his family had just got back from a vacation in Mexico.The young daughters were all excited to tell me about their exciting trip as we were all sitting around after dinner.The beach,the banana boat,Tulum,the whole shot.I asked them their favorite part of the vacation an I'll never forget the 8 yr. old girl's answer.The plane ride. The plane ride, I said,as we all looked on curiously."Yeah",she said."I had daddy all to myself."What kids tell you will blow you away.

[TheDudeAbides]

The major issue that's been ignored in this thread is that of unemployment levels in European nations with high vacation entitlements. I'll look for the numbers in a bit, but I'm certain that unemployment rates are drastically higher in countries like France and Germany than in the US.

So life is great in Europe if you have a job. If not - you're pretty much screwed, as there are plenty of people at least equally qualified as you all pining for the same position.

[Jamougha]

TDA,

Some EU countries have similar unemployment rates to the USA. Some are higher and some are lower. I doubt holiday time has a major impact on this.

Of course you are not really screwed if you are unemployed in most parts of the EU. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]