Minraising the river with a straight, and folding to a shove.

[SilentNoise]

Poker Stars - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $1/$2 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $214.10
BB: $206.00
UTG: $466.15
MP: $174.90
CO: $848.00
Hero (BTN): $439.50

Reads: <font color="blue">villain is xidan_hu , a regular donkey at 200nl. he runs at 28/6/3.25 over 90 hands (this session). the only notable pots ive been in while hes been at the table is where i double barreled vs the table donkey with the nutflush draw and checked down the river, and getting allin with an open ended straightflush draw on the flop vs a bigger openended straightflush draw (typical).</font>

Preflop: Hero is dealt 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6 Players)
UTG folds, MP calls $2.00, CO checks, Hero calls $2.00, SB folds, BB checks

Flop: ($7) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4 Players)
BB checks, MP checks, CO checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($7) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (4 Players)
BB checks, MP checks, CO checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $11.00</font>, BB folds, MP calls $11.00, CO calls $11.00

River: ($40) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 Players)
<font color="red">MP bets $30.00</font>, CO folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $60.00</font>, <font color="red">MP raises all-in to $161.90</font>, Hero folds



Some thoughts on the hand.

1) I didn't raise preflop as i often do because im trying to cutdown on the amount of iso-raises i do with these pretty weak gapped suited connectors. people just dont fold to my cbets.

2) i didn't bet the flop since the pot is multiway and i probably dont have much fold equity.

3) turn bet sizing all wrong? i figured id get called by pretty much anything. the other big stack on the table HATES folding. the table donkey would DEFINATLELY call with any flush draw or any OESD, regardless of the overbet. he just looks at it as 11$ from a 500$ stack.

4) when he leads into me on the river i think minraising still allows me to get value from a load of made hands like top pairs, or 5x.

5) i dont think he would ever shove over my blatent value minraise with 5x, fearing a full house or straight. i dont think he ever does it as a bluff either (since it must look so much like a value bet).

6) When he shoves, i only have the lowest straight possible, on a paired board, hes never bluffing, so whats he doing this with other than the same hand? he definately plays enough to realise that 5x isn't the nuts here i think.

[Sirasoni]

1. fine

2. i still bet flop. Pros to betting: folding out J9s (which has your draw dominated, but will ez fold flop), getting it heads up (then being able to figure out if you could 2nd barrel or not based on the player), folding out XcYc-type hands that might give you trouble later on, building the pot to acquire more value if you actually do hit, giving you the free card option on most turns, etc. Really, the only con to not betting is getting c/r which I don't think happens often on this type of flop.

3. meh i'd probably bet 7 straight but it's not that big of an issue i think, esp. with your reads

I probably call river to be honest, because I can't put him on a single hand that beats us. Any sets that river the boat most likely do not play this way ever (check twice on drawy board, multiway). Any 5x boat probably doesn't either, for the same reason (because they would've had two pair on the turn, and in that case the only real 5x boat he could have is 75 i think).

I really don't know what he'll show up here, but I think considering the fact that hes a 28/6 donkey who has shown absolute weakness on two streets, you're probably often good here. In fact if anything, I guess A5 could do this.

[dotbum]

[ QUOTE ]
5) i dont think he would ever shove over my blatent value minraise with 5x, fearing a full house or straight. i dont think he ever does it as a bluff either (since it must look so much like a value bet).

[/ QUOTE ]

Probably fine against this opponent, but a decent player will rape you for this, as it looks exactly like a value-raise/fold with a good but not great hand (but then you can adjust accordingly, I suppose).

The range that this villain calls this bet with, does he not also call $90/100?

[SilentNoise]

dont get me wrong hes bad, but not so bad that he'd call an 11$ bet into a 7$ pot with just a 5, with somebody else behind him.

i can definately see him playing a set this way because hes the slowplaying type, and also me and the other bigstack donkey at the table have been playing pretty aggressive so he probably thinks we will bet for him.

so you think he shoves the river with AT? 99?

[ QUOTE ]
I really don't know what he'll show up here

[/ QUOTE ]

i think what he shows up with here is pretty important. and i reallly dont think a5 does it. i really dont think a5 gets to this river,and i guess we disagree as to whether he would shove over my raise on the river with it.

[SilentNoise]

bump 1 time, so i guess this was a pretty bad fold then?

[inverted]

I dont like the min raise if your going to fold to a shove, what are you hoping to get value from just 2 pair? I guess its ok if you dont think he will shove 5x, there arent may trip hands that play this line though.

[ikestoys]

[ QUOTE ]
I didn't raise preflop as i often do because im trying to cutdown on the amount of iso-raises i do with these pretty weak gapped suited connectors. people just dont fold to my cbets.

[/ QUOTE ]

then its time to bring out the 2nd and 3rd barrels