The final truth about down swings.

[Schwags]

I firmly believe that downswings happen because of the player, not the cards... Learn to fold in tight marginal situations.. Alot of players i notice when complaining about badbeats and downswings and whatnot, they will play badly until they start getting lucky again, and then their game will pick up from there.. because they are happy again.

If you face a couple beats in a night stop, go out to the bar, get laid, and go back to playing poker.. Its the player that creates bad runs, not the cards... believe me.

[Nigel]

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I firmly believe that downswings happen because of the player, not the cards... Learn to fold in tight marginal situations.. Alot of players i notice when complaining about badbeats and downswings and whatnot, they will play badly until they start getting lucky again, and then their game will pick up from there.. because they are happy again.

If you face a couple beats in a night stop, go out to the bar, get laid, and go back to playing poker.. Its the player that creates bad runs, not the cards... believe me.

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Ummm, no. My guess is you haven't logged many hands of poker.

[Dov]

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I firmly believe that downswings happen because of the player, not the cards... Learn to fold in tight marginal situations.. Alot of players i notice when complaining about badbeats and downswings and whatnot, they will play badly until they start getting lucky again, and then their game will pick up from there.. because they are happy again.

If you face a couple beats in a night stop, go out to the bar, get laid, and go back to playing poker.. Its the player that creates bad runs, not the cards... believe me.

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People do run bad, and can play well through the dry spell.

What you are describing is common, however, and should be looked for by anyone who hasn't conquered a downswing by taking the steps that OP mentioned.

It is usually the first cause. But that doesn't mean it's the final answer.

[Dov]

Good post.

[Aytumious]

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I firmly believe that downswings happen because of the player, not the cards... Learn to fold in tight marginal situations.. Alot of players i notice when complaining about badbeats and downswings and whatnot, they will play badly until they start getting lucky again, and then their game will pick up from there.. because they are happy again.

If you face a couple beats in a night stop, go out to the bar, get laid, and go back to playing poker.. Its the player that creates bad runs, not the cards... believe me.

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You could be the best player in the world and you will certainly have a downswing that is due to nothing more than not getting profitable situations. Saying that downswings are due to nothing more than bad play shows a huge lack of understanding of basic poker mathematics.

[Dov]

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Anyway, everyone has their psychological breaking point. It's our job to make the threshold higher than the varience we experience.

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This is really just a matter of playing within your bankroll and limits.

Still, this has a nice ring to it. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

[xniNja]

I like the post overall. I think there's a lot of truth in it. I've been on a "downswing" for about 2 weeks (about 10,000 hands) and I'm pretty sure if I look hard enough I can find specific mistakes I made and have been making.

[deacsoft]

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I think your post is more relevant to those who've been through the swings a couple times and came through it. Not for someone experiencing the swing for the first time or 2.

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I agree with the point that this is geared more towards someone experienced. They should simply just know better. However, I believe that it may be somewhat relevant to new players too. Allow me to explain this point.

Anyone who wants to start playing poker should do their homework first. Even more rare than the royal flush is a player with no idea who starts playing and becomes a long-term winning player. Again, you need to do your homework first. You read a couple books, post and read on these forums, etc. To maximise your ability to learn and understand you must do some research first. Poker is not set up to be a trial and error game. It is easy to lose and get discouraged early on without the proper mind-set and education. Study up and know what you're getting into. Prepare yourself. They don't grab people off the streets and send them to Iraq. They train them first. Because of this training their chance to survive and be effective in times of war is increased exponentially. So, if you've trained yourself you should have an idea of what to expect. You should know that downswings happen to everyone. You should also know that over time the laws of probability will hold true (or at least close to it). If they are not you have leaks in your game that you have not identified.

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Is it really fair to hold them to a standard when they've never approached the obstacle before? Or don't have that much personal experience with it?

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With an understanding of the correct approach to playing poker, I believe it is. Put some work in to get positive results. It is no ones fault but thier own if they're going into poker blindly. Like everything else in life, there is nothing free in poker. Poker is preformance based. The more work you put into it the better your potential earnings. If they're looking for hand-outs they're looking in the wrong place. Everything I've achieved and every cent I've made in poker is a direct result of countless hours preparation and hard work.

Again, you can't just dive in and expect to win. Do yourself the favor and do your homework first. This will provide you with the best oppertunity to play well and win early on. To do it any other way is just foolish.

(side note to bernie: The aduience I'm addressing in this post changes several times. Much of this I'm not directing at you even though this is a response to your post.)

[deacsoft]

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I firmly believe that downswings happen because of the player, not the cards... Learn to fold in tight marginal situations.

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In some situations this can be the case. However, your "firm" belief needs to be adjusted. It is true that sometimes you will get sucked out pot after pot, miss every draw, and get unplayable starting hands for extended periods of time. The best way to overcome this is to be aware of it and understand it.

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If you face a couple beats in a night stop, go out to the bar, get laid, and go back to playing poker.. Its the player that creates bad runs, not the cards... believe me.

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This is exactly what I'm saying is not necessary. Bad beats will happen. Secondly, they need to understand that bad beats are good. They mean that someone else is playing incorrectly against you. They will get lucky and hit an inside straight draw roughly 1 in 10.5 hands. They win once and you win the other 9.5 times. Sounds like a good ddeal to me. The player needs to learn to deal with bad beats or quit playing poker until they can.

[revots33]

The bottom line is that no 2 people are exactly the same, and so no 1 solution will work for everyone. For some, taking a break can be a big help. Others can plow ahead and play right though the downswing. Whatever works.

Downswings can be tough to deal with. Sure, intellectually we may know they are just a part of the long-term flow of the game. But that doesn't mean it's easy when you're stuck in the middle of one with no end in sight (especially the first time). It's kind of like knowing intellectually that everyone gets their heart broken at some point in their life. This knowledge doesn't help much when the girl you love just dumped you. OK, maybe a bad analogy. But still, just saying "suck it up" trivializes how tough these downswings can be when you're stuck in the middle of one. I personally don't see taking a break, or looking for a little sympathy on 2+2 from those who've been through it, as a sign of weakness.