100NL - Two hands from a session

[DawnToDusk]

One of the hands is just a really small hand and a minor one. Here is some background to my first question.

I just witnessed this hand in the first orbit:

No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.50/$1
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
DASHUSOW: $103.30
Hero: $98
QWISE12: $80.65
MARKM3451: $39.80
TR1CKPOKER: $105.80
BB: $37.80

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is UTG+1 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
DASHUSOW folds, Hero folds, QWISE12 folds, MARKM3451 calls, TR1CKPOKER calls, TALOND1 checks.

Flop: 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($3, 3 players)
<font color="#cc0000">TR1CKPOKER bets $3</font>, TALOND1 folds, MARKM3451 calls.

Turn: 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($9, 2 players)
TR1CKPOKER checks, <font color="#cc0000">MARKM3451 bets $2</font>, TR1CKPOKER calls.

River: 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($13, 2 players)
TR1CKPOKER checks, <font color="#cc0000">MARKM3451 $2</font>, TR1CKPOKER calls.

Results:
Final pot: $17
MARKM3451 Shows Jc Kd
TR1CKPOKER Shows Qd 8c

Now this hand comes up within one oribt of the previous hand(the CO is TR1CKPOKER from the previous hand):

Absolute Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.50/$1
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $80.65
UTG+1: $47.45
CO: $100.95
Button: $35.80
SB: $100.30
Hero: $98

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is BB with T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
2 folds, CO calls, Button folds, SB calls, Hero checks.

Flop: 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($3, 3 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, CO checks.

Turn: Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($3, 3 players)
SB checks, <font color="#cc0000">Hero bets $2</font>, CO calls, SB folds.

River: 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($7, 2 players)
Hero checks, <font color="#cc0000">CO bets $5</font>, Hero folds.
Uncalled bets: $5 returned to CO.

Results:
Final pot: $7

<font color="blue">Question: After seeing how he played middle pair in the first hand do you think I can call profitably here? Do I see a two hearts or a 5 often enough? This may be a really really trivial hand but I find myself folding a lot in these spots but I know sometimes if I had better reads I could probably call profitably. Not only that but just getting better at these situations would improve my hand reading all around.</font>

Onto the more important hand.

Here is some background info to the hand.

I just witnessed this hand:

No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.50/$1
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
TALOND1: $46.25
DASHUSOW: $97.80
Hero: $93
QWISE12: $76.75
MARKM3451: $34.35
PGHMICK: $40

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is CO with 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
TALOND1 folds, <font color="#cc0000">DASHUSOW raises to $4</font>, Hero folds, QWISE12 calls, MARKM3451 folds, PGHMICK calls.

Flop: J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($12.5, 3 players)
<font color="#cc0000">PGHMICK bets $5</font>, DASHUSOW calls, Button folds.

Turn: A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($22.5, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">PGHMICK bets $22</font>, DASHUSOW calls.

River: 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($66.5, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">PGHMICK bets $7</font>, <font color="#cc0000">DASHUSOW raises to $45</font>, <font color="#cc0000">PGHMICK calls all-in $2</font>.
Uncalled bets: $36 returned to DASHUSOW.

Results:
Final pot: $84.5
DASHUSOW Shows Js Qd
PGHMICK Shows Tc Ad

Here is the hand I played in question (UTG+1 is PGHMICK from the previous hand):

No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.50/$1
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $33.85
UTG+1: $80.50
CO: $46.15
Button: $121.30
Hero: $93.50
BB: $74.25

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is SB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, CO calls, Button calls, Hero calls, BB checks.

Flop: 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($6, 6 players)
<font color="#cc0000">Hero bets $4</font>, BB folds, UTG calls, <font color="#cc0000">UTG+1 raises to $15</font>, Hero ?

<font color="blue">Question: I didn't raise PF as I didn't want to play a big pot OOP with AQ. When the flop comes I am fairly certain I am ahead and will make about a 2/3 to pot sized bet a lot. I will check behind on a lot of turn cards though (depending on the opponent) to control the size of the pot. Now there aren't any PT stats. This hand came up within the first two orbits. The only other info I have on this is player (PGHMICK) is how he played the previous hand. After observing the previous hand what do you do here on the flop? </font>

[DawnToDusk]

Seeing if anyone from the morning/afternoon, I guess day crew, has any input.

[manlyman]

Raise AQ pf please, it´s to big of a hand to just complete. Fold to flop raise as played.

[DawnToDusk]

You're always raising out of the blinds with AQ after 4 limpers? They may all fold but assume you raise to $5 and get called in 3 places behind you and you get the same A82 flop. You pot for $20 and then get reraised?

I mean this just seems like a better way to 1)control the pot size and 2)avoid having to make difficult decisions out of position (or at least minimize them). I would hate to have put in like a 1/3 of my stack and then have to fold as someone raised me on the flop. Thats why I just checked, for all the reasons stated above.

Do other people agree with that or would they have raised too?

[ttgirl]

yes, im probably always raising aq oop here, because now you're just playing a guessing game. lol at putting in 1/3 of your stack and folding on an ace high flop after getting rr'd when he originally limped. you also can't check behind on any turn cards becase you have the worst table position, but you said that was your plan for controlling the size of the pot, which is already terrible logic, since the pot size is already controlled by you limping. as played, i would fold since it looks like he's going to put the pedal down, but this was butchered preflop. also it seems like your limp pf neither controlled the size of the pot or allowed you to avoid difficult decisions.

[cfb1739]

[ QUOTE ]

<font color="blue">Question: After seeing how he played middle pair in the first hand do you think I can call profitably here? Do I see a two hearts or a 5 often enough? This may be a really really trivial hand but I find myself folding a lot in these spots but I know sometimes if I had better reads I could probably call profitably. Not only that but just getting better at these situations would improve my hand reading all around.</font>

[/ QUOTE ]

Probably not. He may have played middle pair poorly in the first hand, but that doesn't mean that he has middle pair here. His range has to include 6x and Qx as well as 7x. His range in THIS hand crushes your 10 7. If you had A 7, then it would be closer, but you probably would still need to fold (i'm not sure though..don't have pokerstove at work).

Also, the pot size in this hand is trivial, but when you consider how many of these "trivial" hands you play, it's pretty clear that learning how to play these hands correctly will have a non trivial effect on your earnings.

[ QUOTE ]

<font color="blue">Question: I didn't raise PF as I didn't want to play a big pot OOP with AQ. When the flop comes I am fairly certain I am ahead and will make about a 2/3 to pot sized bet a lot. I will check behind on a lot of turn cards though (depending on the opponent) to control the size of the pot. Now there aren't any PT stats. This hand came up within the first two orbits. The only other info I have on this is player (PGHMICK) is how he played the previous hand. After observing the previous hand what do you do here on the flop? </font>

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't over analyze this situation. Villain is a big fish w/ less than one buy-in. You have top pair 2nd kicker. Re-raise flop and try to get all-in as quickly as possible.

You really should be raising this hand pre-flop.

[DawnToDusk]

[ QUOTE ]
yes, im probably always raising aq oop here, because now you're just playing a guessing game. lol at putting in 1/3 of your stack and folding on an ace high flop after getting rr'd when he originally limped.

[/ QUOTE ]

I still disagree with raising here PF. I am not saying that I am right and you're wrong. Im just not convinced otherwise yet.

And I also think it is kind of silly to put in 1/3 or more of your stack and fold. Just as an aside if you and one of your opponents both put in a 1/3 of your stack and then he puts you all in then you're getting 2-to-1 on your remaining money. Thats not terrible odds at all. But in this case after getting reraised in a limped pot I would be less inclined to fist pump commit after putting in 1/3 of my stack as I'm having a tougher time finding out what I beat. The hand right above this one in my OP has a little more information about the vill. It might lead me to believe that calling is right here but at the same time I am fairly sure that I am going to be faced with a big bet on the turn too. After which time I will probably be faced with calling a river bet just because of pot odds.

[ QUOTE ]
you also can't check behind on any turn cards becase you have the worst table position, but you said that was your plan for controlling the size of the pot, which is already terrible logic, since the pot size is already controlled by you limping.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd be less inclined to control it if I was in position. I do this alot as I don't like playing big pots OOP and I may also get my vill to sometimes bluff at me too.

[cfb1739]

[ QUOTE ]
You're always raising out of the blinds with AQ after 4 limpers? They may all fold but assume you raise to $5 and get called in 3 places behind you and you get the same A82 flop. You pot for $20 and then get reraised?

[/ QUOTE ]

Then you may need to fold. Depends on villain. The situation you described is like a doomsday scenario for this hand. Most of the time you will get one caller, and you will not get re-raised. The caller is probably going to fold to your cbet or pay you off w/ a weaker ace.

[ QUOTE ]

I mean this just seems like a better way to 1)control the pot size and 2)avoid having to make difficult decisions out of position (or at least minimize them). I would hate to have put in like a 1/3 of my stack and then have to fold as someone raised me on the flop. Thats why I just checked, for all the reasons stated above.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, if you DO NOT raise this hand then you are certainly going to put yourself in difficult situations b/c you are going to flop top pair 2nd kicker while letting 3-4 others try to flop the nuts for free. When you get action you will never know where you are at in the hand.

[Bramsterdam]

[ QUOTE ]
I still disagree with raising here PF.

[/ QUOTE ]lol at just completing pre-flop. Raise to 6-7BB's and take it down pre-flop.