2/4 is destroying me (-700 bb stats post)

dhaimon · #1 08-21-2007, 09:03 AM

A 700 bb downswing at 2/4 can't be just variance?

After losing some of my roll there, I just recently had gained enough to try again, within 2500 hands I had lost another 100 bbs. Am I cursed or just bad?

They 3-bet me a lot more, which doesn't help when I hit absolutely nothing.

This whole thing royally blows because I used to beat party 10/20.

I'm guessing some of it is that I'm running somewhat bad at 2/4 and average at the other limits, resulting in a 200 BB net gain and a $1,300 loss.

I play the blinds horribly it would seem. Defend more?

All tabs except general info are filtered for 2/4 only.

Oink · #2 08-21-2007, 09:16 AM

Well, you are prolly running bad.

But forget about ever beating 5/10 and up with those stats. You are WAY to tight and will get run over.

I am sure your style was good enough to win back when a 6 max 10/20 table was you, another 20/16 TAG and three 60/5 fish. Those days are over, now you have to take your money from crazy LAGs and thats not happening with a 20/16 style.

I can honestly say that a table with a 20/16 guy to my left is something I look for. You will be bleeding your blinds to me cuz I open 100% OTB with you in the BB.

EDIT. WOW you are tight in the CO and OTB. We have about the same vpip in UTG but my vpip overall is 12 points higher than yours.

Oink · #3 08-21-2007, 09:20 AM

Also. What is with your AF over 3? Do you ever call postflop? Several good posters here have an AF close to 2 and even below 2. I think mine is 2.05.

Seems like you play a fit or fold strategy postflop.

Guy McSucker · #4 08-21-2007, 09:30 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Also. What is with your AF over 3? Do you ever call postflop? Several good posters here have an AF close to 2 and even below 2. I think mine is 2.05.

Seems like you play a fit or fold strategy postflop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, that's what it looks like.

I would say you are a bit too tight preflop, and too much in the bet/raise-or-fold camp postflop. A lot of the time calling is the right play: save money when behind and get more bets when ahead. Your turn AF is particularly high I think. You probably give up too easily with nothing and bet/raise too much with something.

I would work on postflop before striving to loosen up preflop, for sure. Post some hands.

Guy.

timoK · #5 08-21-2007, 09:56 AM

"I would work on postflop before striving to loosen up preflop, for sure."

if OP beats 10/20 at party he might know about the game.

but I totally aggree with Oink: if the folds SB to steal 90% and fold BB 70% sits to my left or one seat away I will stab him to death and take his blinds like every single time.

and I guess people already do this to you because loosing 0.21 and 0.12 in the blinds is rather bad.
if you fix your blind play leaks you might be able to go to loosing 0.15 in BB and 0.08 in SB (+3k net over 50k sample size)

my advise: learn different blind play

yourface · #6 08-21-2007, 09:57 AM

definately defend your blinds more. as oink alluded to, it is immediately profitable for anyone to make a play at your blind with any 2 cards

raise more from late position. you want to play lots of hands in position against the blinds and weak limpers.

dhaimon · #7 08-21-2007, 10:06 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Well, you are prolly running bad.

But forget about ever beating 5/10 and up with those stats. You are WAY to tight and will get run over.

I am sure your style was good enough to win back when a 6 max 10/20 table was you, another 20/16 T'AG and three 60/5 fish. Those days are over, now you have to take your money from crazy LAGs and thats not happening with a 20/16 style.

I can honestly say that a table with a 20/16 guy to my left is something I look for. You will be bleeding your blinds to me cuz I open 100% OTB with you in the BB.

EDIT. WOW you are tight in the CO and OTB. We have about the same vpip in UTG but my vpip overall is 12 points higher than yours.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well I used to play 25/18 at old party 10/20 but I took a year break and I haven't gotten into my old routine yet. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Guess I'll work on stealing more.

dhaimon · #8 08-21-2007, 10:11 AM

[ QUOTE ]
definately defend your blinds more. as oink alluded to, it is immediately profitable for anyone to make a play at your blind with any 2 cards

raise more from late position. you want to play lots of hands in position against the blinds and weak limpers.

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you guys routinely raising low suited connectors or offsuit aces in late pos after one limper?

Oink · #9 08-21-2007, 10:18 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Well, you are prolly running bad.

But forget about ever beating 5/10 and up with those stats. You are WAY to tight and will get run over.

I am sure your style was good enough to win back when a 6 max 10/20 table was you, another 20/16 T'AG and three 60/5 fish. Those days are over, now you have to take your money from crazy LAGs and thats not happening with a 20/16 style.

I can honestly say that a table with a 20/16 guy to my left is something I look for. You will be bleeding your blinds to me cuz I open 100% OTB with you in the BB.

EDIT. WOW you are tight in the CO and OTB. We have about the same vpip in UTG but my vpip overall is 12 points higher than yours.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well I used to play 25/18 at old party 10/20 but I took a year break and I haven't gotten into my old routine yet. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Guess I'll work on stealing more.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you want to beat online poker above 1/2 you have to do a lot more than that and its not a guess.

You can not fold your blinds a smuch as you do. You will get killed.

You can not play so few hands in position as you do. You will leave some VERY profitable spots on the table. Say you have 97s OTB and two idiot is in the blinds, do you ever raise here?

You can not beat online games above 1/2 with such a high postflop AF. You are simply folding and betting/raising WAY too much.

Your wtsd is low'ish. Combined with your very low vpip you really dont see a lot of SDs. There is two possible reasons for this. a) You fold too much and b) your opponents knows you are tight and doesnt give you action. So loosen up and see more SD's.

As I said. Your style was prolly ok 2 years back when party 10/20 was a freaking goldmine. But as the online games play now there is now way you can beat any game above 1/2 playing that style. Looking at your stats I would consider you a fish in my games.

Oink · #10 08-21-2007, 10:20 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
definately defend your blinds more. as oink alluded to, it is immediately profitable for anyone to make a play at your blind with any 2 cards

raise more from late position. you want to play lots of hands in position against the blinds and weak limpers.

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you guys routinely raising low suited connectors or offsuit aces in late pos after one limper?

[/ QUOTE ]

Depends on the blinds, but often I will raise A7o - A6o and T9s - 98s after 1 bad limper. If the blinds are loose I wont raise those weak Axo but overlimp suited connectors.

As a start i think its mandatory for you to read stox book about preflop play.