Potential Monster Hand that I was forced to lay down...plz critique

[HardGrind]

I was forced to lay down what would have been the winning hand. Being that I was UTG w/ AK i felt it would be best to just limp in hoping to catch somehthing on the flop. To my delight the A drops along with a diamond draw. I elected to elimate anyone chasing the flush so I made it 3 to go( blinds .10/.25). imassn9 raises to $5 & i immediately felt my ace was in trouble. I knew at that point in the hand that I was beat so the only logical option for me was to fold. Surprisingly VIPER calls Imassn large bet & whatdayaknow?...the king drops on the turn. Although I still felt like i made the right move there. VIPER manages a huge suckout on the river to win with AJ.

I felt my laydown was a good decision based on the given circumstances. However, I want the esteemed opinions of 2+2 inorder to tell me if this could have been played differently. Did I missplay my hand? And if so, what could i have done? Thanx.


Full Tilt Poker Game #3293834542: Table FullTiltForum.com - $0.10/$0.25 - No Limit Hold'em - 20:47:05 ET - 2007/08/18
Seat 1: catempire ($8.70)
Seat 2: HeeaVeeN ($25.40)
Seat 3: seper777 ($10.30)
Seat 4: imassn9 ($25.30)
Seat 5: Misanthrop ($24.90)
Seat 6: HardGrind ($11.25)
Seat 7: csmooth23 ($8.05)
Seat 8: hbk420 ($22.20)
Seat 9: vipercraze ($8.90)
imassn9 posts the small blind of $0.10
Misanthrop posts the big blind of $0.25
The button is in seat #3
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to HardGrind [Ah Kd]
HardGrind calls $0.25
csmooth23 calls $0.25
hbk420 folds
vipercraze calls $0.25
catempire folds
HeeaVeeN calls $0.25
seper777 folds
imassn9 calls $0.15
Misanthrop checks
*** FLOP *** [Ad Qd 4c]
imassn9 checks
Misanthrop checks
HardGrind bets $0.75
csmooth23 folds
vipercraze calls $0.75
HeeaVeeN folds
imassn9 has 15 seconds left to act
HeeaVeeN is sitting out
imassn9 raises to $5
Misanthrop folds
HardGrind has 15 seconds left to act
HardGrind folds
vipercraze calls $4.25
*** TURN *** [Ad Qd 4c] [Kh]
imassn9 bets $3.65
vipercraze calls $3.65, and is all in
imassn9 shows [4h Ac]
vipercraze shows [As Jh]
*** RIVER *** [Ad Qd 4c Kh] [Jc]
imassn9 shows two pair, Aces and Fours
vipercraze shows two pair, Aces and Jacks
vipercraze wins the pot ($18.60) with two pair, Aces and Jacks
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $19.55 | Rake $0.95
Board: [Ad Qd 4c Kh Jc]
Seat 1: catempire didn't bet (folded)
Seat 2: HeeaVeeN folded on the Flop
Seat 3: seper777 (button) didn't bet (folded)
Seat 4: imassn9 (small blind) showed [4h Ac] and lost with two pair, Aces and Fours
Seat 5: Misanthrop (big blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 6: HardGrind folded on the Flop
Seat 7: csmooth23 folded on the Flop
Seat 8: hbk420 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 9: vipercraze showed [As Jh] and won ($18.60) with two pair, Aces and Jacks

[AKQJ10]

1. Please use a hand converter to make this easier to follow. One I suggest is http://www.neildewhurst.com/hand-converter/ , but apparently it now requires registration.

2. Why exactly did you limp AK? If you wanted to limp/reraise and had reason to expect a raise behind you, that's defensible. Otherwise, you should absolutely be raising this hand anywhere at the table.

3. Betting the flop is fine. At this stack size (SPR=9.0) TPTK is somewhat hard to play, but unless you know imassn9 to be very straightforward and even timid about flop raises, sticking all the money in with AK is probably not too bad. If you know him to be a timid raiser who'd never raise here with less than two pair, folding is obviously imperative.

4. As it happened he had flopped two pair with a badly dominated hand. (Perhaps A4 wouldn't have played if you'd raised preflop. If it did, it was making a grave mistake to call a raise and got outrageously lucky.) The fact that you would have caught a three-outer to beat him is absolutely irrelevant to whether you played correctly or not.

You must learn to forget about the cards that come out on the board after you've folded in the analysis of the hand -- in other words, you must learn that playing this flop correctly has nothing to do with the turn card that comes out -- or you will never progress in poker.

It's a pretty marginal flop decision either way, and you didn't play it drastically wrong (although aggressive players will raise your flops to death if they know you fold AK here, so don't always fold it). It's frustrating that the turn would have won for you. But the river could have won for someone with a ten. In any case, try to put aside cards that are out of your control.

[HardGrind]

Thanx, Broadway....i appreciate the input.....I felt that maybe if i would have made it 3-6 bb preflop it would be a bit over agressive considering that i just sat down at the table a few hands prior. Plus me not being in good position was another reason why i choose not to raise. Once again thanx for the reply AKQJ10

[xMars]

you have AK, what hand do you need to raise?
AK is an autoraise no matter the position. only reason not to raise if you know aggressive players behind you and intend to reraise them

[AKQJ10]

In this hand I probably raise more than the "standard", i.e. 5xBBL or something, because (1) as you say playing out of position sucks, and I'm not horrified at taking down the blinds; better yet would be to go heads-up with one of the blinds. (2) After reading PNLHE I'm all into SPRs and trying to make the pot a convenient size on the flop. If the pot's, say, $2.85 with about $10 behind, two bets gets you all-in if you get a flop you like.

Being positionally aware is great, but xMars is right. If you don't like AK here then you're essentially only raising big pairs. That makes you really easy to read, for one thing, but more importantly it denies you value from hands like AQ and AJ (probably even Axs) that will call you here.

So raise.

[Cry Me A River]

Hand history converter:

http://www.legopoker.com/hh/index.php

[Greg Miller]

If you raise to about $1.25 and get called in only place, you can bet pot on that flop and call an all-in without having made any blunders, since you're getting something 2-1 odds to call with TPTK.

If you get called in two places, you get an absolute minimum of 3-1 if someone raises all-in.

Notice how much simpler the hand plays if you don't limp? It becomes an instant call unless you have some way of knowing your opponent would never (or almost never) make the raise with less than two pair.

[phydaux]

* GRUNCH *

Raise pre-flop with AK. AK has a bunch of pre-flop equity, so you want there to be a lot money in the pot pre-flop. However, AK does NOT play well in a multi-way pot. Ideally you want to see the flop head's up with someone holding a hand like QQ/JJ or AQ/KQ, then have an A or a K flop.

Plus, you're UTG. You'll be OOP to most opponents the entire hand. You don't want to be OOP without the initiative. Bet, and make then fear you.

AND your short stacked! You either have to re-buy, or quit playing hit-to-win poker. Get aggressive, boy!

Come the flop, you didn't bet enough to chase out draws. A half-pot bet offers your first opponent 3:1 to call. When you factor in implied odds it's easy for a chaser to call. And once the first opponent calls, the rest are correct to call based on pot odds alone.

Head's up make a pot-size bet here. In this situation, make an overbet.

When SB check-raises, you SHOVE. That's the nature of your chosing to play that stack size - You are playing trying to get all-in on flop with top pair. If that's not how you're playing, then you need to choose a different stack size. But, you then also need to understand the dynamics of deep stack play.

[stickdude]

Others have commented on the specifics of this hand, but one of the first lessons to learn is that you need to evaluate decisions, not results. Everyone who has played poker for any length of time has folded 72o preflop only to see a 772 flop - does that mean it was a mistake to fold preflop? Of course not.

[pzhon]

[ QUOTE ]

Raise pre-flop with AK. AK has a bunch of pre-flop equity, so you want there to be a lot money in the pot pre-flop. However, AK does NOT play well in a multi-way pot.


[/ QUOTE ]
Actually, AK, even AKo, does fine in multiway pots. It's still better to raise in most situations (including this one), but hope people make incorrect calls.

[ QUOTE ]
When SB check-raises, you SHOVE. That's the nature of your chosing to play that stack size - You are playing trying to get all-in on flop with top pair.

[/ QUOTE ]
If there had been a raise preflop, then it would be clear to get the money in with a 45 BB stack. However, with so little of the money going in preflop, you should be more cautious pushing with TPTK. It may still be right, and it's what I would do.

The villain almost gave a free card on a very coordinated board. Since no one raised preflop, it was much more likley that the flop would be checked through. That check-raise looks like a semi-bluff to me, not a value/protection raise.