Post flop marginal hands.

Alexost · #1 08-14-2007, 10:58 PM

I have a pretty good grasp of how to play premium hands, but am wondering what more experienced players think of the following marginal situations.

This hand I call with, however I rarely play weak suited connectors yet, and if I do its only nine ten, and occasionally eight nine. I was hoping to get more money in the pot after my call, but as you see only one other call.

PokerStars 0.50/1.00 Hold'em (8 handed) Hand History converter Courtesy of PokerZion.com

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
2 folds, Hero calls, 4 folds, BB checks.

Flop: (2.50 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets, Hero raises, BB folds.

Final Pot: 2.75 BB

This hand I am in the BB and am not sure what to do since I have middle pair with weak kicker, so I bet, to see where I'm at. If I am raised, I fold, but other than that I really wouldn't know what to do.

PokerStars 0.50/1.00 Hold'em (7 handed) Hand History converter Courtesy of PokerZion.com

Preflop: Hero is BB with 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 4 folds, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (3 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG folds, SB folds.

Final Pot: 2 BB

Point Blank · #2 08-14-2007, 10:59 PM

has someone been reading Hellmuth's book?

Point Blank · #3 08-14-2007, 11:04 PM

T9s in ep-mp is not always playable ... really depends on the game and those behind you .. once it's folded to you in late mp think about raising (depending)

when you say 'hoping to get more people' ... what do you mean ... you shouldn't 'hope' for anything - you either expected to get a boatload of weak passive callers or you didn't

hand 1 post flop ... looks good to me

hand 2 post flop ... that's about the ugliest flop you can get (I probably bet this most of the time) - but if I have good knowledge on the ep guy I can see just letting this go

Alexost · #4 08-14-2007, 11:12 PM

[ QUOTE ]
has someone been reading Hellmuth's book?

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't puke on me. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] Yes, I've read his book, as well as Super system 2, ITH, SSHE, Theory of Poker, Arnold Snyders Poker Tournament Formula and umm, Texas Holdem by Ken Warren.

Before I get skewered here, I like to get an overall grasp of different authors to see what they and readers are thinking, and I don't necessarily have a favorite book, but I have found things in every book that I like.

I have only been playing poker for a couple months.

Point Blank · #5 08-14-2007, 11:19 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
has someone been reading Hellmuth's book?

[/ QUOTE ]

Don't puke on me. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] Yes, I've read his book, as well as Super system 2, ITH, SSHE, Theory of Poker, Arnold Snyders Poker Tournament Formula and umm, Texas Holdem by Ken Warren.

Before I get skewered here, I like to get an overall grasp of different authors to see what they and readers are thinking, and I don't necessarily have a favorite book, but I have found things in every book that I like.

I have only been playing poker for a couple months.

[/ QUOTE ]

don't read so many books ...

super system ... sucks
hellmuth ... sucks (though, you will not have to think to play)
TOP ... to advanced

stick with one book ...

Lee Jones or Ed Miller ... Ed Miller will lead you to spew early and Lee Jones plays a much safer game

since you have SSSH - just stick with it ... and understand that the online games now aren't loose-passive

Alexost · #6 08-14-2007, 11:24 PM

[/ QUOTE ]
since you have SSSH - just stick with it ... and understand that the online games now aren't loose-passive

[/ QUOTE ]

This is generally what I've decided to do, and I do understand the online games usually aren't loose passive anymore. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Thanks for the replies PB.

Point Blank · #7 08-14-2007, 11:30 PM

[ QUOTE ]

[/ QUOTE ]
since you have SSSH - just stick with it ... and understand that the online games now aren't loose-passive

[/ QUOTE ]

This is generally what I've decided to do, and I do understand the online games usually aren't loose passive anymore. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Thanks for the replies PB.

[/ QUOTE ]

i make note of that because all the action in the book (from the starting hands, to the post flop play) are all based on that condition ... when reading over the book think about how the hand plays differently when you introduce new conditions

Aaron W. · #8 08-15-2007, 12:29 AM

For hand 1, you should raise if you're going to play. I would fold. Flop raise is fine. Take note of this villain and raise him more often than you think you should.

For hand 2, it's fine. I bet a lot of flops from BB when there's only one limper and SB checks on the flop.

Nick D · #9 08-15-2007, 01:38 AM

[ QUOTE ]
For hand 2, it's fine. I bet a lot of flops from BB when there's only one limper and SB checks on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Aaron, what happens if we get at least one caller and the turn comes something other than a 9 or 5? Should we fear that we are behind or continue to bet until shown resistance?

Aaron W. · #10 08-15-2007, 11:16 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
For hand 2, it's fine. I bet a lot of flops from BB when there's only one limper and SB checks on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Aaron, what happens if we get at least one caller and the turn comes something other than a 9 or 5? Should we fear that we are behind or continue to bet until shown resistance?

[/ QUOTE ]

Heads up, I would bet once more. Two callers and I give up. If you pay attention in spots like this, you will start to figure out the frequency with which he peels the flop, and this will guide you on whether you should bet again.