Sonics are as good as gone?

[bernie]

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TBH, the people did not vote for the M's new stadium, we were FORCED to pay for it.

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We didn't vote for it twice.

Meanwhile, the Seattle Public schools went bankrupt because of it. Nice that they sacrificed the 'kids' for a few years on that one. But what the hell, we'll also have the kids do a bake sale for a tree that was supposed to be donated to them. The priority of the city is pretty effed up. Then to top it off, the Mariners "let us off the hook"(per Lincoln) for the cost overruns. Those same overruns that they said they'd pay for in the first place but then tried to force us to pay for. F*ck the mariners.

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I think its a joke anyways that public money has to be paid for new stadiums to be built. Then this [censored] think its THEIR stadium/arena.

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I agree.

But then everyone going to the game or buying their merchandise is sending a nice message that, even though you screw the public, the public will still support you. The dollar speaks more than someones opinion. Which is why I won't give one cent to the mariners directly. That's how I vote.

At least we voted for Qwest field. Even though the city paid, at least the people wanted it.

Let 'em go to Okl. One of these days fans will finally wise up and get some balls and make these owners pay for their own stuff.

I also agree that an owner should be able to move wherever they want. They own the team. If it's a bad market, he should feel it the most. The problem is the government, or governments of other cities, provides them with a safety net.

You get what you pay for. Most don't want to realize they're paying to screw themselves. The city not cowing down to the sonics is a step in the right direction.

b

[TurdFerguson]

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I think its a joke anyways that public money has to be paid for new stadiums to be built. Then this [censored] think its THEIR stadium/arena.

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Look how much it's costing NY'ers for the new Yankees and Mets stadiums...

I guess you're in the camp that public financing of stadiums is "thinly veiled corporate welfare".

But there are obvious economic and quality-of-life benefits in keeping your team in town: spurring the local economy, civic pride, saving on future cost of attracting a team (if Seattle ever wants an NBA team again). So I wouldn't say it's a joke. If the public benefit outweighs the outlay of a municipal financing of the stadium... it's not really that bad imo at all.

My main qualms with public financing of stadiums is that 1) mainly benefits the owners and other wealthy individuals; 2) obviously these public funds could be better directed towards stuff like schools, bridges, etc.

Also I wasn't aware that there were any stadium financings with binding public votes - I thought they were always advisory (meaning the voting public doesn't really have a say anyway).

-Al

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[ThaSaltCracka]

Bernie, I don't hate the M's. In fact I love them. However the way that whole stadium thing went down was [censored].

I fear that if the Sonics move to OKC, they'll be moving 10 years after that to somewhere else. Sort of like Memphis, who will probably move in 5 years as well.

[Jeremy517]

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It sucks for the Sonics fans but when the Mariners and Seahawks got new stadiums built with tax money it was pretty clear that the Sonics would expect something as well.

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The city paid $75 million to renovate Key Arena about 12 years ago.

[NozeCandy]

They won't have Dids chowing down on hot dogs in OKC, how can they ever hope to make up those millions?

[Dids]

Bernie's take on the financial aspects of the new stadium is pretty wrong headead and typical of the reactionary Seattle fan...

[TheNoodleMan]

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They won't have Dids chowing down on hot dogs in OKC, how can they ever hope to make up those millions?

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I heard on espn8 that Dids weight loss was making Seattle a less profitable market.

[teamdonkey]

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I don't think OKC can support an NBA team long term with the current financial model. They will sell out for a year or two, but eventually the ridiculous NBA ticket prices will start to chase people away.

Median incomes (from Wikipedia, FWIW)- Seattle $45,736, OKC $34,947. That doesn't include all the billionaires and multimillionaires living on Mercer Island, and on the Eastside. I am guessing there is a LOT more money in the greater Seattle area than in the OKC metro region.

I will be LMAO when these [censored] have their hands out for public assistance in OKC in 5 years.

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Seattle is the #12 market in the US. OKC is #45. The Seattle DMA has 4x the population at a 30% higher household income.

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if by DMA you mean downtown metropolitan area, i think you're understating the OKC market... Seattle has another team pretty close (Portland) while OKC only has Dallas to the south and noone to the north/east/west. They'd likely have a big fan base in Kansas City, and probably even in places like Omaha and St. Louis. The market for a team in OKC may be pretty close to the size of one in Seattle. Attendance should speak for itself, as it was higher in OKC than in Seattle when the Hornets were there, so we're really only talking about other revenue here.

Household income is not much of an issue either. Yes the median income is 30% higher in Seattle, but cost of living is also 29% higher. The difference in disposable income is negligable.

[ThaSaltCracka]

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if by DMA you mean downtown metropolitan area, i think you're understating the OKC market... Seattle has another team pretty close (Portland) while OKC only has Dallas to the south and noone to the north/east/west. They'd likely have a big fan base in Kansas City, and probably even in places like Omaha and St. Louis. The market for a team in OKC may be pretty close to the size of one in Seattle.

[/ QUOTE ] You make it sound so simple. You needn't think about the population about Seattle, instead you need to think about the population in King County. Second, you are right Portland is close by, but the Portland area (Vancouver, WA included) is big as well. Vancouver, BC is three hours away, Spokane is 5. The Pacific Northwest is a big market.

Secondly, why would people in Kansas City or St. Louis be more interested in a team in OKC then the Bulls, Pacers, or Grizzles? All are comparitively close.

[Clarkmeister]

DMA = designated market area, which is how all analysis/metrics are calculated. It's not as simple as say a 25 or 50 mile radius.