What is good about faith?

[ApeAttack]

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According to happiness studies -- and I'm not familiar with the methodology, but they are considered credible in the academic psychology world -- religion is +EV for happiness.

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EV+ compared to what? compared to atheism? i dont think i have ever met one unhappy atheist. atheist seems to appreciate the life they have more, since they know its the only one they'll get.

most studies claim that
lack of faith -> higher IQ
higher IQ -> more money
more money -> more hapiness
qed.

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FWIW, I am agnostic heavily leaning toward atheism.

You have NEVER met one unhappy atheist? You don't know many atheists then.

For me personally, I spend a significant amount of time thinking about what happens after death. It would be a relief to know that all will be well if I just go to church and believe in an all-mighty God.

And as for your 'proof', haven't you seen this?!?!
Lisa Simpson... qed

[ApeAttack]

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If you sincerely believe the words you wrote, I hope you quietly go to the Hell you have mentally constructed for yourself.

And I mean that with all due respect.

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How ruddddddeeeee. You give atheists a bad name. Double frowny faces for you.
[img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[ApeAttack]

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I'd say religious faith is good for individuals otherwise unable to walk a generally straight societal line (for their own good as well as others). You know the typical joke of "people always seem to find Jesus in jail..." or an AA meeting.

I'm talking not of individuals that must steal to survive or whatever.

I'm pretty anti-religious but some people do better with it than others. Most atheists don't seem to acknowledge the positive aspects of faith, they do exist; life is not black and white. I can't see all people using the "science worldview," respecting life and fellow humans, etc. Science requires too much training, thought, and energy to really appreciate. So it may not be a good enough substitute for the general populous, unfortunately.


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Although this may be a well-known idea, I don't think I've ever thought of religion in this way. Nice post.

[ApeAttack]

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The church I went to had plenty of people that were

a) unhappy and
b) didn't really care about others

I agree that this communal happiness can be attained through religious practices, but to say that it can't any other way or that by simply attending church happiness is attained is ludicris (which is the tone of some of the posts).

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People are unhappy everywhere for various reasons (money, love, family, work, death, etc.).

I wonder if religious people are less-likely to be unhappy specifically with regards to the afterlife and death than atheists. I don't think religion would help much with work-place worries.

[Justin A]

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The belief in something greater than yourself can lead to joy and peace. The atheist always has to worry about death, about unfairness, about his own selfish interests.

By trusting in a higher power, we can find grace and love in our lives and leave much of the pettiness of the world behind.

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As an atheist, your statement frustrates me. The atheist does not always have to worry about death, or unfairness, or his own selfish interests, any more than the religious person has to worry about his constant battle with "Satan," religious persecution, or "sins" of the flesh.

By trusting in each other and above all ourselves, we can possibly find peace of mind and serenity and leave much of the religious backwash of the world behind.

If you sincerely believe the words you wrote, I hope you quietly go to the Hell you have mentally constructed for yourself.

And I mean that with all due respect.

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You're a moron. Phil was playing devil's advocate. Even if he wasn't, your post would still be moronic.

[IcemanDan]

Faith itself isn't necessarily all that great.

The Church does a lot of charitable work though. Can't argue with that. Now that most of the crusade-type work is over, they probably do more good than bad.

[Atrophy]

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I hate to rain on your parade, but you're the one going to hell if you continue to keep your head in the sand about Jesus Christ.

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So should I just be worried about denying Jesus Christ, son of God, or the countless other human constructions to which many cling for happiness and morality?

[foal]

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The ultimate reality is that nothing matters. Rape, pillage, kill someone else, kill yourself -- or don't, it really doesn't matter.

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We dislike pain, we feel empathy for others, we have a sense of justice, we would rather not go to prison, etcetera.

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Yes, but does it *ultimately* matter if you experience pleasure or pain in bountiful quantities? No. I'm not arguing that people aren't motivated by desires. Obviously they are. Rather, I'm saying that the fact that there is no overarching reason for your existence, coupled with the fact that your existence will be terminated in the merest blip of a merest blip, renders any reason why you do this or that essentially moot. If you believe otherwise then I think a kind of implicit faith (that what you are doing DOES matter for some reason) must underlie that belief.

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I totally disagree. If our current life will be our only time of consciousness it is not a blip TO US. An hour feels like an hour no matter how long the universe has existed or will continue to exist afterwards.

If you believe in a spirit that carries on eternally THEN this life is just an insignificant blip. All that's really important is doing what it takes to get in to heaven, reach enlightenment or whatever the specifics of your religion are.

[hemstock]

IMO religious faith is just an excuse for being ignorant and trying to give existane a meaning and a purpose. Also beleiving in a higher order with no proof at all whatsoever and presenting that as an achievement is really something anyone can do and still feel good about themselves pretending they are accoplishing something important.

So yeah, faith is good if you wanna feel good.

[craig]

Faith allows young men to believe they will go to heaven after they blow themselves and others up. It allows people to cut their baby boy's foreskin off. It allows large groups of people to hide Nazi's..blah blah blah...it also is used as a good tool for God to test us with. Like when he put the dinosaur bones in the ground to test our faith. Or HAD to kill his only child in order to show is love. I mean it isn't like he could have shown us any other way.

edit: I was going to delete this, because it was written like a 16 year old kid who grew up in the suburbs and listens to punk rock. I probably could have written the above much better and not have been so sarcastic.

I think that it is strange that some people think that society losing faith is such a bad thing or that our politicians have to believe in God (or appear to do so..hmm..would I rather have an atheist's or born again christian's finger on the button???). There is much more evidence that points to more progress being made when religion and faith are either left alone, or at best, not in some way sponsored by society/gov.

craig