NL Tips for Limit Players

[diebitter]

Preflop Bet sizing

In NL Ring, the usual raising bet is around 4xbb + 1 bb per limper. If you're playing nl25 for example, the bb is 25c, so open raising is 4x.25=$1. You may be used to NL tourneys maybe, so note the raises are generally higher preflop in ring games compared to tourneys. That's cos ring game players really want it Heads Up or 3-handed at the most if you have decent holdings (decent usually means AJ+,99+), and frankly, you need to raise like this in ring games to get that effect - ring players will not be intimidated by 2xBB raises at all, and 3xbb is a weak raise in tough or aggressive games.

Another example at nl25 is if you're in the CO with KK, and get 2 open limpers, you should raise at least 4xbb + 2xbb (one per limper) so at least $1.50

A reraise is typically 3x the usual raise, so if you raise a dollar, a reraise is often $3. If you have a coldcaller or two for your dollar raise, don't be surprised that any reraise may be significantly stiffer than this (say $5-$6) - but remember the point of raising and reraising preflop is not to fold everyone, it's to reduce the field to the serious players in the hand and give players that look like they might stick around poor odds, but still enough rope to hang themselves. Raising big with AA to force folding is turning the hand into 72off.

Please note this 4xBB + 1 per limper is contentious, and there are schools of thought that suggest lighter raises earlier are better (Phil Gordon for example in his Little Green Book argues for 3xbb early and bigger later), or that lighter raises later are better, but there is pretty much universal agreement that whatever standard you adopt, there should be absolutely and positively no clear relationship between your hand strength and the size of the raise. You let that slip into your play, you'll get gutted at any decent game.



What do callers/completers usually mean after you raise?

Well, for similar reasons to the same occurrence in Limit. Callers usually mean someone likes their hand enough to stick around but it's not good enough to reraise. This is almost always a more speculative hand (though AA/KK sometimes limp here if they are closing the betting and it's HU), and so we're talking about middle-low pocket pairs, Axs and suited connectors (maybe even 1 gapped). Of these, pocket pairs are by far the most likely to be played - for their set value. They are easy to play being so obviously fit-or-fold, whilst the other holdings usually flop, at best, a decent drawing hand.
4-5 players speculating in a given hand are not good in NL, which is why the raising is reasonably stiff. NL players hate being 5-handed and holding AA, even though the pots grown pretty darn large (AKs is a different story). A reraiser to your raise will be doing the RR to stop speculative hands entering, and to usually get HU with you.

[JerBear77]

Sticky this, good stuff!

[Wolfram]

[ QUOTE ]
You may be used to NL tourneys maybe, so note the raises are generally higher preflop in ring games compared to tourneys. That's cos ring game players really want it Heads Up or 3-handed at the most if you have decent holdings

[/ QUOTE ]

This is true, but not quite accurate.

The big reason for why we raise more in cash games is because cash games usually play deeper, and therefore you often need to raise more to sufficiently cut down on opponents implied odds and to get decent value for your strong hands. The name of the game is stacking your opponent and to be able to do that effectively you need to build the pot early, so that following pot sized bets will end up putting them all-in.

In tournaments, you reallywant to get any possible value from your good hands because the increasing blinds put a time pressure on you. Also, implied odds go way down for calling hands because of ICM and the gap principle.

[BigPoppa]

2 other things to mention:

1) Top pair with a medium kicker is a seriously crappy hand, especially in a multiway pot. There is almost no way it is good if you meet any real resistance.

For this reason, it is often best to toss hands like AT/AJ/KJ/KQ in a raised pot and to either raise or fold them in a limped pot.


2) Position is far more important in NL than in limit. While having position in limit can save you a bet or two, in NL it can save your whole stack. For this reason, hands that are completely unplayable UTG or in the blinds can be raising hands on the Button (see #1).

Also for this reason, don't defend your blinds with crap hands. It'll just put you in a tough spot after the flop. You really, really don't want ATo OOP on an AJ6 flop, especially against an aggressive player.

[theblitz]

Two more points:

1. NEVER fold KK pre-flop. Even if he raised and you re-raised and he pushed - call!

2. If you play a small PP for set value you must be prepared to go all the way. Don't talk yourself out of it afetr the flop.
For example, if you called a pre-flop raise with 33 and then hit an AK3 flop then be prepared to back your hand with all your stack. Don't try to guess if you are losing to a higher set.

[Dogballs88]

Also, draws are oftentimes played differently in NL than in limit - your expressed odds won't be nearly as good as they are in limit, and depending on how tough the game is, your implied odds may or may not compensate you enough to justify continuing, even with a strong (8-9 out draw), especially on the turn betting round.

I know it's often correct in limit (either for value or as a semi-bluff) to bet your good draws, but in NL vs. tough/aggressive opponents that can read hands well, you may just bet yourself off your hand when you're greeted by a large raise. Of course in limit you can't be pushed out unless the pot is very small to begin with.

Also, check-raising is much more dangerous in NL.

[4_2_it]

Most villains bluff a lot less often than you think. If she is betting, she usually has some sort of a hand.

Of course, villain's idea of what constitutes a 'raisable' hand vs reality is what hero has to figure out.

[Grunch]

[ QUOTE ]
Most villains bluff a lot less often than you think. If she is betting, she usually has some sort of a hand.


[/ QUOTE ]

Along the same vein, some of the biggest losers in NL are the ones that worry about getting run over too much.

[Matt Flynn]

assume everyone is a pussy until proven otherwise. big bet => big hand until you see a bluff or semibluff.

everyone bluffs less than you think.

play tight as hell OOP until you're comfortable. then play just really tight OOP.

fold your blinds far more often until you get your sea legs.

this'll sound bad coming from me, but PNL was tailor made for switching, not because it covers the differences but because it shows how to think about nl hands, and it's not hard.

i started by switching from 20-40 under Tommy Angelo in 2000-01 to $10-$10-$20 $40-to-go nl under Alex Roberts in 2001-2. dropped 31K in the game back when that was real money. that's when i figured out much of SPR after getting nailed on a few kings hands. so the switch drove my thinking and is inherent in much of the writing, even though we don't say "compared to limit" outside of the Position chapter.

[daca]

Agree with Matt flynn in every thing off course.

Another one, if someone weakly donk bets after youve raised preflop just raise. Its always a draw, someone betting for "information" or some [censored]. Also people who instacalls are always weak or on a draw.