WSEX: Official Monthly Thread: July. (#11 of 12.)

[yeliabttocs]

Fred,

Now that you are actually charging some rake, I strongly recommend that you have a consistent fee structure for all tourneys (say 10%). It's not fair to charge a 50% fee for a $2 tourney ($2+$1), a 20% fee for a $5 tourney ($5+$1), and a 10% fee for a $10 tourney ($10+$1). Please modify so we start seeing $2+$.20, $5+$.50, etc in the near future. Thanks much.

[6471849653]

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75% RB is great, but with no HUD, higher rake, and tougher competition there are other sites out there that will be more profitable.

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No-limit holdem to me has never been a problem as far as the rake goes (less so with rakeback), it being more important to have good games, multitabling (the other table covers at least the rake) - bigger and looser sites and PokerTracker and its softwares make all that possible.

Limit poker's rake is the problem at most all places. At WPEX the -75% only makes playing 2-4 and 3-6 there suspect as the games are not that good (as a sportsbook place its not typically loose though the aggression partly is/was) and multitabling is suspect without software helps and the straight type of rake hurts there the most (about a double rake), except about heads up (50c cap - though propping that would be 0c as long as it stays heads up). With no rakeback 25c/$5 after a days play at 2-4 means $50 more rake compared to no rake before $20 (that's how it originally ever since from 1999 was and still is at some places - the games are there tougher), while with 50c/$10 the 2-4 sucks in that case an extra $25. There are also jackpot games these days at some places like Absolute and Party, spoiling those games further as it's a 50c extra drop that could double the rake again. Now limit poker rates to get more props (there are some sites with enough to plenty customers too in case one plays at least 2-4 or 3-6 and similarly at big bet poker) as they don't generally pay rake, and the bonus players together with rakeback deals, multitabling. At least in my case WPEX is now out as there are better deals for me till I work my way up to $5-$10 at least.

[6471849653]

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they aim to provide a fun service to their sports bettors

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What comes to poker, it's a sport (sports bettors should understand that and like the competition and the challenge) and a game of skill like chess and played with money that makes it serious - one should pick one's own level (and keep improving) and if one plays just for the fun there are lower limit games and play money games.

I don't see they have made it a "fun" place for their sports bettors, and if that's their aim they have made it all wrong as it's open to all, all tables (they could have made it all private or like at some places there are already hidden tables that are only for some people, the other customers not seeing them).

What I don't understand about WPEX is that they originally a sort of said that "why not give it to the players," meaning their sports bettors, and the site is open for all - and poker is mainly for the poker players, not for the sports bettors. And what about now that it's 75%, why they did not originally say that it's temporary, that some there though indicated as "for now" or something like that, while it was clear from the point of there being a rake; if it's rake free/no rake, there is no rake, no rakeback.

And removing the opponents' names from the hand histories is suspect as well as making poker harder to play (that's the opposite of fun, and the softwares help only with basic observations that one otherwise can't do well by multitabling, while the real poker is above those basic observations that's just work while when the softwares are doing it one can play more tables and poker is fun rather than a work and one plays more hands per hour) and takes away the action of multitabling in many cases; they don't understand online poker and business; softwares like PokerTracker are a factor that's good for all. Also the lack of opponent's names (that I think still can be got to hand histories semi-automatically, and those who make their own softwares could read the names from the screen. So, it remains to be seen when they allow name changes like every week, e.g at Cake one can change basically as often as one wants though there is some warning about not to abuse it but I don't know what that means) is a security risk for the players, making the place somewhat suspect.

At least one thing they should understand, that their poker site is for poker players, not for the sports bettors.

[mjkidd]

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At least one thing they should understand, that their poker site is for poker players, not for the sports bettors.

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For their sports bettors who play poker.

[TwoCathedrals]

The games are still really good; there's just not enough of them. So far courier withdrawals for me have not taken longer than 2 weeks, and I request one every monday after rakeback. We'll see what happens with the one I requested today.

I will indeed say that WPEX's #1 problem is lack of traffic, but their #2 problem is difficult of withdraw methods

[Hairball]

1. If a player is all-in and loses a hand, the hand-history does not list that players hole cards.

2. Open a table with a player you have notes on and join the wait list. If the player you have notes on leaves the table and you take the seat, the "N" icon stays on your name.

[Benjamin]

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Wait a minute... isn't 75% contributed rakeback the equivalent of around 37% dealt rakeback full ring (roughly 50% dealt rakeback shorthanded)?

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No, that is inaccurate.

My last 22k hands at 10/20 full ring (7.1 players average):

Contributed rake: 5298
75% Contributed rakeback: 3974

Mean Gross Rake (i.e. 100% rakeback dealt hands method): 6452

So, from this sample of hands with me playing a tight game, 75% contributed rakeback equals 62% dealt hands rakeback.

But, if the game were contributed rakeback in those hands, I would have played a bit looser and claimed a somewhat higher percentage back.

[Benjamin]

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1. If a player is all-in and loses a hand, the hand-history does not list that players hole cards.


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Yeah, I'd been meaning to bring this one up. Please fix!

B.

[Mitch Evans]

What process did you use in pokertracker to obtain contributed and dealt figures for 22k hands?

[Seether]

To find contributed its simple its just your total rake paid in general tab. To find your mgr (dealt rake) you go to game notes and load all the hands you want.