beating the calling stations

[ceire]

i need some tips on how to beat calling stations i know you should v-bet and keep v-betting but i play 6max and i find by the time i get a hand they have already taken my money by calling down my c-bet, i always seem to get a hand in position like ak, aj, TT, and end up raising only to be called by one of these players in the big blind then call my c-bet with as little as middle pair (what i need to know is do i just fold these hands preflop or give them straight up after the flop i feel this is as good as throwing chips away) I also have a problem playing against the same type of player who raises more? Should i be opening up my calling hands in position trying to hit it big or be rerasing then, i really am lost as what to do.

[Pants Optional]

c-bet less

[ceire]

how much less against them? should i be betting 50% of the time? less more

[Peleus]

From a newbie -

The point of the cbet is to take down the pot showing strength you largely don't usually have once you missed the flop. Against a calling station this is largely useless because you have no fold equity in you're bet. You know if you're betting with two overcards they are calling you down with a trashy pair.

Best way to punish them is to tighten up a bit, wait until you get a bit of the flop and bet for value, waiting for them to call down you're good hands you can win at the showdown with, rather then trying to get them to fold, which by definition of a calling station, they won't do.

Edit - I know you're playing 6 max, and what you said about the time you get a hand you're bust. Perhaps loosen up the starting hand requirements you have, but check/fold more on the flop once you don't catch. Minimize you're losses and maximize you're value of the winning hands.

[itWASaDREAM]

Really they are going to call anytime they hit a piece, whether it is a gut shot, or a flush draw, or even middle pair. I think that beating the calling stations is going to have a lot to do with c-betting more sparingly and value betting your more marginal top pair hands when you have seen them calling bets to the river with middle pair or worse hands. There is a great article in one of the old internet magazine editions about c-betting that I suggest you read.

I think that it is going to be slightly player dependent. There are some players that will not lay down ace high until the river, and you need to find these players and get as much value as you can.

[foxmoor]

[ QUOTE ]
From a newbie -

The point of the cbet is to take down the pot showing strength you largely don't usually have once you missed the flop. Against a calling station this is largely useless because you have no fold equity in you're bet. You know if you're betting with two overcards they are calling you down with a trashy pair.

Best way to punish them is to tighten up a bit, wait until you get a bit of the flop and bet for value, waiting for them to call down you're good hands you can win at the showdown with, rather then trying to get them to fold, which by definition of a calling station, they won't do.

Edit - I know you're playing 6 max, and what you said about the time you get a hand you're bust. Perhaps loosen up the starting hand requirements you have, but check/fold more on the flop once you don't catch. Minimize you're losses and maximize you're value of the winning hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

if the board is dry you can fire a second-barrel make it 70%+ of the pot but this is a high-varince play.

the first play is the most right thing to do but you can try the second play also sometimes

[Goodnews]

revert to the sshe style of play whilst keeping bets >1/3 of the pot

[infinite_loop]

Get PokerStove and run some hands you've played and determine your probable equity on certain boards. It's important to read your equity well in loose low stakes games because often all you're doing is value betting, but with a lot of people in a hand you're going to get drawn out on a lot. There's no way around this and frankly these are the easiest games you'll find. Be grateful they're so bad.

Also when you're c-betting think about flop texture and how likely this board would hit a hand they go to the flop with. I really focused on this instead of just betting every single time and my game improved drastically. You're going to raise a lot of hands in position that you're going to have to check behind with and dump when they throw their crappy turn bet out. It's just how it goes when you have no FE.

[ceire]

Thank for all the help guys, i just i have to be more willing to let go of hands when i have put money in the pot.