Step by Step vs 2+2er

[terp]

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Oh and about preflop I guess I just have this stubborness but I hate CO/Button raisers habitually firing in late position. I like to play back at them. Sure it would be sick if I was on the button and had position but I just don't think nitting it up and folding these sorts of hands is the way to go because certain people think he has a big edge on me OOP.

I'm 60% raise, 25% call, 15% fold, by the way.

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fg i know you think i'm an [censored] but i just want to point out a huge part of my winrate comes from fish who look at their blinds as personal property and as a free flop viewing ticket. fish HATE to have them stolen and are thus goaded into playing OOP all the time.

just something to think about

[terp]

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I can't imagine folding PF- how are you playing winning poker if you are? You're passing up on a very lucrative situation, IMO.

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delta [censored] has spoken.

/thread

[bilbo-san]

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AggJedi,
We have less fold equity in your terms (money behind) if we inflate the pot PF. What we accomplish is some range deception and we have a higher chance of getting more money in if we like our hand since our bet sizes are now larger due to a bigger pot.


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When you have a TON of stack left and a small pot, you have LESS fold equity.

This is because if you make a raise, it isn't all-in, and it isn't making a statement like "I'm ready to go all-in here, dude."

[bilbo-san]

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I think it's worth bearing in mind when playing this that we are behind virtually and pair with a lone diamond, e.g. 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

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lol no

unless you want to open-shove flop and use chat to tell him to use PokerStove

and wtf? you said fold pf? how do you have as many posts as me.

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Sweet drama.

OK, I want you guys to HU for rolls because I think I can make more money betting on Jam than I can playing poker.

[bilbo-san]

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Oh and about preflop I guess I just have this stubborness but I hate CO/Button raisers habitually firing in late position. I like to play back at them. Sure it would be sick if I was on the button and had position but I just don't think nitting it up and folding these sorts of hands is the way to go because certain people think he has a big edge on me OOP.

I'm 60% raise, 25% call, 15% fold, by the way.

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So you hate it when CO/Button raisers fire all the time, even though YOU get to play the button 1/6th of the time, too.

So you combat this by calling a lot. Which, if I am not mistaken, is pretty much EXACTLY what the "CO/Button raisers habitually firing in late position" want you to do.

ESPECIALLY given your approach post-flop, which seems to run along of the lines of "Erm, idk wtf to do here."

[drj003]

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I would just fold preflop. You have a weak hand and I doubt you have an edge over him, let alone a big edge.

Can't cr the flop, your hand is just not good enough even 100BB deep. I don't like cc but I guess it's an option. I would normally lead the flop.

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Exactly.

[drj003]

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I think it's worth bearing in mind when playing this that we are behind virtually and pair with a lone diamond, e.g. 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

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lol no

unless you want to open-shove flop and use chat to tell him to use PokerStove

and wtf? you said fold pf? how do you have as many posts as me.

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Brian Townsend has folded those types of hands in the bb very often in his videos. I don't go strictly by his play all the time, but you have to admit that if someone that good folds those types of hands in the bb, then it might be a good idea.

[jk3a]

Gators,

I've played quite a few hands with you and respect your game in general. However, you are defending your blinds way too much imo. I don't mind calling raises against donks who will stack off light, but doing it against "good" players is a significant leak IMO.

Try to think in terms of the individual EV of the call you are making and let go of the metagame for a second. It's hard for me to imagine that metagame is all that important at these levels anyway.

[drj003]

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How often do we actually flop a hand that we're comfortable putting more than one bet in postflop, aka a big draw, trips, two pair etc?

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Hell, we flopped 2 pair here and still can't figure out how to play the hand.

Anyone who thinks that there's a problem with FGators folding this preflop is crazy or doesn't understand all the variables of this hand.

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Agreed. It's not like nation is going to donk off 200bbs every time he has an overpair or TP. Why would you want to play to a huge pot OOP with 8 high against a solid player? attack the donks, play in position, ez game.

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Definitely. This hand shows how much trouble you can get in playing a weak hand OOP. Anyone who says that folding preflop in this hand is bad, cleary doesn't understand position.

[Nick Royale]

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AggJedi,
We have less fold equity in your terms (money behind) if we inflate the pot PF. What we accomplish is some range deception and we have a higher chance of getting more money in if we like our hand since our bet sizes are now larger due to a bigger pot.


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When you have a TON of stack left and a small pot, you have LESS fold equity.

This is because if you make a raise, it isn't all-in, and it isn't making a statement like "I'm ready to go all-in here, dude."

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Wow this is beyond retarded. Having more money left to lose after calling a raise is obviously a reason to fold a marginal hand, because the odds to get to sd may be worse than calling the raise. Re-raising preflop basically means your playing the pot less deep postflop thereby both players should be more inclined to felt marginal hands given that they've seen the flop.