live 6/12, ace-rag top pair from the BB

[mntndrew]

First hand, so no reads.

Four players limp, BN raises, SB folds. Hero looks down at A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] in the BB likely getting better than 10:1 against five opponents. Hero calls, as do all the limpers.

Flop [11.7 SB]: A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

First question, is this a pre-flop fold, or do all the callers make it worthwhile? I'm almost always calling these suited ace-rags (but folding the offsuit ones) when the pot looks this big but I'm wondering if it's a leak.

On the flop, with no backdoor flush draw, I see my options as check-raising the BN/check-folding to a MP bet and any caller or two bets; bet-calling and then check-folding the turn unimproved; and bet-folding the flop. None too attractive, which I suppose explains the problems of ace-rag top pair hands. If you play this hand before the flop, what line do you prefer?

[KitCloudkicker]

i would attempt a CR to fold out broadway gutshots and random Q's or 8's and get it heads up. if the button is straightforward he will 3 bet us if we're beat and we can fold the turn UI. if button calls and we're heads up i bet any turn card.

the pot at this point is quite large and it is worth taking the risk of check raising into a better hand such that it gives us a better opportunity to win the pot. i would also make this play with middle pair (e.g. QT, KQ) for the same reasons. not to mention that i have seen people fold KK on the turn if i CR with middle pair and the pot becomes heads up.

i also agree with your preflop call. 10:1, unless you have a genuine fear of someone 3 betting behind you, you should be calling here with any two suited cards.

[Little Wing]

Yeah, preflop I would call with a suited ace too.

I think I just bet out on this flop, though, and see what happens.

[Jantjebeton]

I like going for a c/r if the button bets. Gives you the opportunity to look at the action of the 5 players behind you. If one the limpers bets and someone raises him, you can fold I think.

[Niediam]

Preflop: If you can play decently postflop this is a call with any two suited. Folding Axs here would be very bad.

Flop: I check and raise a LP bet. If EP bets and gets some callers I guess I fold. If EP bets and it's folded to me I'll call down.

[Maliant]

Not a good flop for your hand imo, no one bet-folds?

[KitCloudkicker]

[ QUOTE ]
Not a good flop for your hand imo, no one bet-folds?

[/ QUOTE ]

leading the flop and allowing all gutshots and 2 pair draws in for 1 bet is bad. folding the flop to a single raise given the pot size is godawful.

[Maliant]

Yes, but you have 3-outs once that u can't even get value on, because its no where near the nuts, he's not raising a lesser hand here.

[KitCloudkicker]

[ QUOTE ]
Yes, but you have 3-outs once that u can't even get value on, because its no where near the nuts, he's not raising a lesser hand here.

[/ QUOTE ]


if the PFR showed me AK face up im not folding the flop for 1 bet. DUCY?

plus if you hit the 4 you are in perfect position to CR the button on the turn, shutout the rest of the field and have a great shot of winning the hand.

folding top pair for 1 bet in a multiway raised pot preflop is a huge leak and will cost you big time in the long run.

[James.]

pretty easy spot to check and see.