Roulette Croupier Manipulation?

[kyleb]

lol these posts are so funny, you guys really are bat [censored] insane

[sonneti]

Well if there isnt any possibility of it working why are the dealers instructed to use different size balls, change the speed of the wheel & vary the speed of their throws?

[Ringo]

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Well if there isnt any possibility of it working why are the dealers instructed to use different size balls, change the speed of the wheel & vary the speed of their throws?

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For the same reason there are baffles and spinning wheels - the more randomness, the better.

[sekrah]

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Well if there isnt any possibility of it working why are the dealers instructed to use different size balls, change the speed of the wheel & vary the speed of their throws?

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For the same reason there are baffles and spinning wheels - the more randomness, the better.

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So you concur that using the same speed and ball size is not 100% random, and that one with an expert eye to detail can find a +EV edge in roulette under those circumstances?

[talentdeficit]

i'll concede that it's not outside the realm of possibility someone can manipulate roulette as claimed in this thread, what i think is ridiculous is the assertion that people who can do this are employed by casinos to screw over the customers in a game that is already massively profitable for the casinos.

[Jimbo]

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The roulette wheel is very far from "random". Casino's (especially smaller ones and Indian) use a skilled croupier to "clean out" a table.


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Dimbest statement I have read in the past eight years. Do you see why? No? A hint: Players are allowed to place bets, ,move bets, pick up bets both before and after the ball is released and you expect any sane person to not only believe the croupier can not only spin a ball into a specific slot but also read minds. Funny stuff!!

Jimbo

[jackhigh]

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i'll concede that it's not outside the realm of possibility someone can manipulate roulette as claimed in this thread, what i think is ridiculous is the assertion that people who can do this are employed by casinos to screw over the customers in a game that is already massively profitable for the casinos.

[/ QUOTE ]

I feel like we are playing "there's a hole in the bucket" lol.
Here is an explanation from one of my previous posts.


"This is very logical. A roulette table takes up valuable casino floor space, is very slow action and usually requires 2 dealers. Do you think a casino would be happy with just a 5ish percent return on a very slow costly game? If you think about it, even the dumbest of the dumb tourist gambler basically plays a "perfect strategy" when they pick any bet but one (5 bet-1,2,3,0,00) on the roulette wheel. All but one bet always has a 5ish percent house edge (don't know exact number and too lazy to look it up). Compare this with other casino "dumb tourist"table games, slots, keno, etc. Look at all the "bonus spot" table games with huge casino vig, most tourists don't play perfect basic blackjack strategy giving up huge vig to the casino, keno, slots- no need to elaborate on these. Craps have many "sucker bets" hard ways etc. that juice the casinos profit. Casinos aren't in business to just have a 5% house edge on a low volume game. So they basically "cheat" by aiming the ball - most noticeably in smaller casinos with minimal valuable floor space."

For all you naysayers... the answer is simple! Next time you're in Vegas goto Oshea's or Casino Royale... and just watch the dealer! Either he's aiming or he isn't... it's that simple. If he's aiming - he's watching and waiting for a target number to come around before he releases the ball. If he's not aiming... he is simply releasing the ball without looking at the wheel.

If he is "aiming" make a mental note of the number/sector he is using as a target number when he releases the ball (usually 00,or 0). Compare this to where the ball lands and see if you can predict the outcome next time you see him releasing on the same target number/sector.

Post your observations!

(I'll be in Vegas on Thurs (7-12), I'll let you know if they still do it) [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[jackhigh]

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The roulette wheel is very far from "random". Casino's (especially smaller ones and Indian) use a skilled croupier to "clean out" a table.


[/ QUOTE ]

Dimbest statement I have read in the past eight years. Do you see why? No? A hint: Players are allowed to place bets, ,move bets, pick up bets both before and after the ball is released and you expect any sane person to not only believe the croupier can not only spin a ball into a specific slot but also read minds. Funny stuff!!

Jimbo

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Repost of an explanation:

This too is a false argument. Most roulette players are not "system" players and simply have no clue what is going on. The majority of roulette bets are in the middle center of the layout 17,20 etc.. There is an 8 number "sweet spot" section right before the 00 that is statistically proven to receive the least amount of bets. The dealer simply aims for this section... the house probably doubles or triples their vig, thus making roulette profitable enough to justify 2 dealers and valuable floor space (in the smaller joints).

If a dealer spots a "section" player (not hard) he simply throws a random ball and the section player goes away quickly.

One time, playing at "Casino Royale" in Vegas, i was "randomly" (trying to disguise my play pre spin) playing the "sweet spot" section on a full table and one of the dealers kept yelling out "he's on the numbers" to the croupier... totally obvious. I was playing at the Taos Mtn Casino several years ago and was totally rockin the table quadrupled my buyin playing the "sweet splits" (i would split my sweet spot bets depending on the croupier release thus covering opposite sections... making it harder for the croupier to aim away from my sections). The pit boss came over, totally sweating me a few spins, and then whispered something in the dealers ear. On the very next and subsequent spins the dealer said "no more bets" instantaneously after he threw the ball! This obviously killed my advantage... I cashed in and walked (to their delight)."

Once again... go to Oshea's and check it out for yourself!

[Jimbo]

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[ QUOTE ]
i'll concede that it's not outside the realm of possibility someone can manipulate roulette as claimed in this thread, what i think is ridiculous is the assertion that people who can do this are employed by casinos to screw over the customers in a game that is already massively profitable for the casinos.

[/ QUOTE ]

I feel like we are playing "there's a hole in the bucket" lol.
Here is an explanation from one of my previous posts.


"This is very logical. A roulette table takes up valuable casino floor space, is very slow action and usually requires 2 dealers. Do you think a casino would be happy with just a 5ish percent return on a very slow costly game? If you think about it, even the dumbest of the dumb tourist gambler basically plays a "perfect strategy" when they pick any bet but one (5 bet-1,2,3,0,00) on the roulette wheel. All but one bet always has a 5ish percent house edge (don't know exact number and too lazy to look it up). Compare this with other casino "dumb tourist"table games, slots, keno, etc. Look at all the "bonus spot" table games with huge casino vig, most tourists don't play perfect basic blackjack strategy giving up huge vig to the casino, keno, slots- no need to elaborate on these. Craps have many "sucker bets" hard ways etc. that juice the casinos profit. Casinos aren't in business to just have a 5% house edge on a low volume game. So they basically "cheat" by aiming the ball - most noticeably in smaller casinos with minimal valuable floor space."

For all you naysayers... the answer is simple! Next time you're in Vegas goto Oshea's or Casino Royale... and just watch the dealer! Either he's aiming or he isn't... it's that simple. If he's aiming - he's watching and waiting for a target number to come around before he releases the ball. If he's not aiming... he is simply releasing the ball without looking at the wheel.

If he is "aiming" make a mental note of the number/sector he is using as a target number when he releases the ball (usually 00,or 0). Compare this to where the ball lands and see if you can predict the outcome next time you see him releasing on the same target number/sector.

Post your observations!

(I'll be in Vegas on Thurs (7-12), I'll let you know if they still do it) [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

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I am beginning to think you actually belive this stuff. Now that is more scary than amusing. A casino would kill to have a consistent guaranteed 5% edge across the board. As far as a dealer "aiming" accuraterly enough to make bettors lose you are nuts.

Jimbo

[Humble Pie]

This doesn't have much to do w/ manipulation (of the roulette wheel) but it's a pretty good movie. For those of you who haven't seen it check it out.