What to do on flop with JJ against persistent opponent?

Gorgias · #1 07-07-2007, 06:40 PM

Hey all, this is my first 2p2 post. I've been reading for a while but am just beginning to play regularly. So, I'm still working on putting basic, ABC poker into action.

I often find myself in this situation--with a good, but not great pair on a board against an opponent who keeps representing strength. At these stakes, should I just believe him?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

BB ($18.60)
UTG ($12.65)
MP ($7.20)
CO ($6)
Hero ($14.80)
SB ($6.15)

Preflop: Hero is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
2 folds, CO calls $0.10, Hero raises to $0.3, 1 fold, BB calls $0.20, CO folds.

Flop: ($0.75) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $0.4, Hero calls $0.40.

Turn: ($1.55) 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $0.95, Hero raises to $2.4, BB calls $1.45.

River: ($6.35) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $3, Hero ?

TheRenaissance · #2 07-07-2007, 06:44 PM

Repop flop and shut down after that.
The key to microstakes unlimited hold em is to put your opponent to a decision for a reasonable amount of chips.

hennnerz · #3 07-07-2007, 06:45 PM

Raise like $0.5 pre. (4XBB +1BB each limper). Might make the hand play a bit easier post flop. Here I would like to either raise or fold this flop. The call won't give us much info.

As played fold river every day of the week here.

tannenj · #4 07-07-2007, 06:53 PM

pokerstars, huh?

[ QUOTE ]
Repop flop and shut down after that.

[/ QUOTE ]

no, try again.

gorgias: a pot-sized raise is to $0.45 preflop. 30 cents is too small.

flop play is good. i probably fold turn if you don't have a read (and you didn't provide one, so i assume you don't have one). if you don't fold, call. when you raise, you're bluffing.

you're getting more than 3:1 on the river (only have to be good 25% of the time for calling to be +ev), but he has a queen almost always, fold river.

don't get too attached to stuff like JJ when overcards fall on the flop. you had a big hand preflop, but once the flop comes, you might as well have T8o.

PaulS · #5 07-07-2007, 07:04 PM

A good guideline preflop is to raise to 4bb plus 1 extra for every limper in the pot. On the flop a call is fine. Though he may have a Q, it's also very possible for him to have a straight draw, a T, or a lower pocket pair. The weaker the range of hands he leads with, the more you should raise. But since you probably don't know much about this guy, calling is good.

I don't like raising the turn unless the opponent is really loose and likely to call with any pair. unless this is true, most of the hands that call your raise will have you crushed, and you will force most weaker hands to fold. While your raise is good if he has a draw, draws are somewhat less likely since you have two of the Jacks, so they comprise a smaller portion of his overall range.

Players at this level tend to be passive, so I could see folding this turn. Calling the turn with the intention of folding to a river bet or checking it down (if possible) also seems like a reasonable plan.

The river is a pretty clear fold. Villain's line is pretty strong, and if he was on J9 or KJ, he now has you beat.

TheRenaissance · #6 07-07-2007, 07:04 PM

[ QUOTE ]
pokerstars, huh?

[ QUOTE ]
Repop flop and shut down after that.

[/ QUOTE ]

no, try again.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, you are right.
pretty dry flop, no point in raising.

listen to tannenj.

tannenj · #7 07-07-2007, 07:12 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
pokerstars, huh?

[ QUOTE ]
Repop flop and shut down after that.

[/ QUOTE ]

no, try again.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, you are right.
pretty dry flop, no point in raising.

listen to tannenj.

[/ QUOTE ]

fwiw, i'll raise the villain's flop bet pretty often if i have air.

TheRenaissance · #8 07-07-2007, 07:25 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
pokerstars, huh?

[ QUOTE ]
Repop flop and shut down after that.

[/ QUOTE ]

no, try again.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, you are right.
pretty dry flop, no point in raising.

listen to tannenj.

[/ QUOTE ]

fwiw, i'll raise the villain's flop bet pretty often if i have air.

[/ QUOTE ]
yeah me too, and i will raise with a made hand too if the flop has a flush-/str8draw. but this one is pretty dry, so it's better to try and get to showdown cheap.

viper930 · #9 07-08-2007, 02:40 AM

the flop texture doesnt matter that much, you shouldnt be raising even on an fd flop with this hand

LegendLength · #10 07-08-2007, 03:42 AM

One reason I might call this is that it's unlikely he has j9 or jk straight draws because you hold two of the jacks. And if he has qx then the $3 bet on the end is a little large considering the king came out. Also the fact that he called your turn instead of rerasing makes it less likely he has a queen (although the board is quite dry).

If you have a read that might make you doubt him I'd give it a call to find out.