Stoxtrader open raising range?

[TheWunderkind]

Iam curretnly watching the new video form stoxpoker and he raises 67s from the CO 5 handed and then he has TJo UTG 4 handed and says he was used to raised this but now he mucks [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Sry for still not reading through his book maybe someone who did can give me an answer.

[ILOVEPOKER929]

[ QUOTE ]
Iam curretnly watching the new video form stoxpoker and he raises 67s from the CO 5 handed and then he has TJo UTG 4 handed and says he was used to raised this but now he mucks [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Sry for still not reading through his book maybe someone who did can give me an answer.

[/ QUOTE ]

In Stox's book, 2 out of the 3 player profiles lost money with JTo in the CO. Maybe Stox is not making money with that hand either so he decided not to play it without any compelling reads.

[TheWunderkind]

fwiw he also raises T9s UTG 6 handed, thats really confusing how he cannot raising TJo in the Co 1st in

[ILOVEPOKER929]

[ QUOTE ]
fwiw he also raises T9s UTG 6 handed, thats really confusing how he cannot raising TJo in the Co 1st in

[/ QUOTE ]

All 3 player profiles had a positive BB/100 with T9s 3 off the BTN. There really isnt anything confusing about Stox's choices. He is simply playing hands that are profitable and folding hands that arent, and hes using empirical evidence to guide him. Sample size/variance will always be an issue but the heart of Stox's strategy is sound.

[RunDownHouse]

He's also just human and makes mistakes. If I had to pick one, I'd go with what he decided to publish in print over what he said while filming an internet video.

[yourface]

wow he folds TJo in the CO 4 handed?
I'll raise TJ 9T and 8T (sometimes) at a lot of 4 handed tables.

[TheWunderkind]

well 2/3 players loose money with K8s from the CO but all 3 make money with K7s, there are plenty of this examples. I think its results oriented.

ILP iam not saying open T9s UTg is bad its just to show how it confuses me that TJo is not an open raise for him from the CO while iam not judging this or anything. Iam just wondering why JTo is not profitable form 1 off while for example T9s is profitable 3 off.

Iam curious about your results , for me it shows a decent profit while my sample is very limited.

[yourface]

all those suited connector hands are affected the most by short term variance

I glossed over all of those tables in stox's book, but I'm going to go back and check those mid offsuit hands when I get home.

[NinaWilliams]

JTo is profitable for me on the CO.

[danzasmack]

Suited hands have higher variance than offsuit ones, I think he mentions this in the book.

I strongly disagree with this method of analyzing hands, especially with the availability of things like pokerace. Only playing profitable hands is simply not possible IMO, especially in aggressive, shorthanded games, which is what this book was about. As I understand it, the books gives a rough starting hand guide for the game. I don't think you should be taking that as the be-all-end-all of what makes money from where and if you should play something from this position.

1st off, if you are not comfortable with something don't do. You're not going to play it correctly postflop.

2nd, what to open in the CO is really a much bigger question based on the game you're in, how you play, what your image is to other players (which should honestly be different from 'how you play'), and what you think of other players (which should honestly be how they play [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img])

Take 2 players who are polar opposites and put them both in the CO. So I am a lag in the CO with JTo and I open raise. Rule out a button who is a LP fish or hypermaniac or just terrible, these are separate situations. Talk about some abc-tag sitting on the button with 600 mined hands on me who basically fills 2-3 seats in your typical online 5/10 or 10/20 game.

So he sees me open. With my big ATSB. His 3-betting range is going to include a much wider range. A8o. KTs. All these things that he assumes are profitable against me because, well, I open raise a ton of [censored].

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Now put someone with a tight open raising range. Go to extremes, say a 15/12 opens in the CO 6 handed. Are you 3-betting A8o? What is profitable here? What do you have to assume he opens here for you to be 3-betting him with specific hands? What's your 3-betting range vs. a 22/16? Again, these numbers, I'm talking about types of players not a number-based approach to the game, throw your favorite 2p2er in here.

How would you play top pair vs. both of these players? As I mentioned in another post, vs. a lot of players I'll cap/lead AJ on a J54, against some I'll call a 3-bet and c/c down because i'm chopping or losing or he's doing his "lol i decide to bluff".

Now on the other end of JTo, we have AA in the cutoff. Who is going to make more with AA in the CO? Easy answer to that.

So basically, I don't see why we care what hands are profitable in the CO. It doesn't matter. All that should matter is whether or not your play is profitable in the CO. What is your winrate in the CO? Should you tighten up/loosen up? Should you seat select better? There are a lot of other things that go into it. If you find that JTo is profitable for you in the CO, I don't see why you would stop raising it.

I don't think this really gets my point across as well as I'd like, if i didn't make any sense here let me know.

I'm in no way criticizing the text btw, just the way a LOT of people seem to be approaching it.