NL Rake: No Flop/No Drop - The Rule or the Exception?

[BigBluffer]

First the good news: Florida is getting NL cash games for the first time starting July 1.

Now the bad news: I asked in my local Native American casino (Seminoles) about the no flop/no drop rule. I was told that a minimum of $1 will be taken out of every pot, whether we see a flop or not. (The rake is 10% up to $5 plus a $1 jackpot drop when the pot reaches $10)

So, in a $1/$2 blind game, any attempt to steal the blinds will only result in a $2 profit. Even worse, if the small blind attempts to steal the big blind, his profit will only be $1.

I thought the no flop/no drop rule was virtually universal. How common is it? Or do most cardrooms take a rake even if there's no flop?

As an aside, in places where they take a rake even on a no-flop hand, what if the blinds agree to chop? Do these rooms still take a rake then?

[Lord_Strife]

Tampa Greyhound is going to strictly abide by this rule. No flop/no drop even if the pot is $100. This also applies to 7card stud... no fourth street no drop.

[BigBluffer]

[ QUOTE ]
Tampa Greyhound is going to strictly abide by this rule. No flop/no drop even if the pot is $100. This also applies to 7card stud... no fourth street no drop.

[/ QUOTE ]

At least the floor at the Seminole cardroom confirmed that they won't be raking an uncalled bet/raise. [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]

So, if someone wants to raise $100 in a $1/$2 game, he won't be raked on his raise. That would be hilarious. Raise $100, the blinds fold ($3 total), the house rakes their $5 max, lose $2. I'll bet that happens somewhere. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[psandman]

[ QUOTE ]
First the good news: Florida is getting NL cash games for the first time starting July 1.

Now the bad news: I asked in my local Native American casino (Seminoles) about the no flop/no drop rule. I was told that a minimum of $1 will be taken out of every pot, whether we see a flop or not. (The rake is 10% up to $5 plus a $1 jackpot drop when the pot reaches $10)

So, in a $1/$2 blind game, any attempt to steal the blinds will only result in a $2 profit. Even worse, if the small blind attempts to steal the big blind, his profit will only be $1.

I thought the no flop/no drop rule was virtually universal. How common is it? Or do most cardrooms take a rake even if there's no flop?

As an aside, in places where they take a rake even on a no-flop hand, what if the blinds agree to chop? Do these rooms still take a rake then?

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually there are two different issues here.

First is no flop/no drop, but the second is the statement that a minimum of $1 will be taken.

If playing a $1 - $2 blind game and a player raises and succesully steals the blinds the pot size was in fact only $5. Taking $1 here would be a 20% rake (contradicting the other statement).

So if they really meant that a minimum of $1 will be taken you are correct, But if they really mean simply that there is no flop no drop then a blind steal would not be affected.

[RR]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
First the good news: Florida is getting NL cash games for the first time starting July 1.

Now the bad news: I asked in my local Native American casino (Seminoles) about the no flop/no drop rule. I was told that a minimum of $1 will be taken out of every pot, whether we see a flop or not. (The rake is 10% up to $5 plus a $1 jackpot drop when the pot reaches $10)

So, in a $1/$2 blind game, any attempt to steal the blinds will only result in a $2 profit. Even worse, if the small blind attempts to steal the big blind, his profit will only be $1.

I thought the no flop/no drop rule was virtually universal. How common is it? Or do most cardrooms take a rake even if there's no flop?

As an aside, in places where they take a rake even on a no-flop hand, what if the blinds agree to chop? Do these rooms still take a rake then?

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually there are two different issues here.

First is no flop/no drop, but the second is the statement that a minimum of $1 will be taken.

If playing a $1 - $2 blind game and a player raises and succesully steals the blinds the pot size was in fact only $5. Taking $1 here would be a 20% rake (contradicting the other statement).

So if they really meant that a minimum of $1 will be taken you are correct, But if they really mean simply that there is no flop no drop then a blind steal would not be affected.

[/ QUOTE ]

There is actually only one issue here. They have never had this sort of poker int he past and they don't have an understanding of what differnt rules would mean to the players and don't fully understand the question.

[BigBluffer]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
First the good news: Florida is getting NL cash games for the first time starting July 1.

Now the bad news: I asked in my local Native American casino (Seminoles) about the no flop/no drop rule. I was told that a minimum of $1 will be taken out of every pot, whether we see a flop or not. (The rake is 10% up to $5 plus a $1 jackpot drop when the pot reaches $10)

So, in a $1/$2 blind game, any attempt to steal the blinds will only result in a $2 profit. Even worse, if the small blind attempts to steal the big blind, his profit will only be $1.

I thought the no flop/no drop rule was virtually universal. How common is it? Or do most cardrooms take a rake even if there's no flop?

As an aside, in places where they take a rake even on a no-flop hand, what if the blinds agree to chop? Do these rooms still take a rake then?

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually there are two different issues here.

First is no flop/no drop, but the second is the statement that a minimum of $1 will be taken.

If playing a $1 - $2 blind game and a player raises and succesully steals the blinds the pot size was in fact only $5. Taking $1 here would be a 20% rake (contradicting the other statement).

So if they really meant that a minimum of $1 will be taken you are correct, But if they really mean simply that there is no flop no drop then a blind steal would not be affected.

[/ QUOTE ]

Perhaps I should amend my statement to "The STATED rake is 10% up to $5." And, to repeat, I was told that a minimum of $1 will be taken out of every pot, whether there is a flop or not.

This is all background though. Do you have any insight into the main point of my post, which is to try to determine the universality (or lack thereof) of the no flop/no drop rule, which it seems the Seminoles have never heard of?

Secondarily, in rooms where a rake is taken even in no-flop hands, what happens when the blinds agree to chop?

[BigBluffer]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
First the good news: Florida is getting NL cash games for the first time starting July 1.

Now the bad news: I asked in my local Native American casino (Seminoles) about the no flop/no drop rule. I was told that a minimum of $1 will be taken out of every pot, whether we see a flop or not. (The rake is 10% up to $5 plus a $1 jackpot drop when the pot reaches $10)

So, in a $1/$2 blind game, any attempt to steal the blinds will only result in a $2 profit. Even worse, if the small blind attempts to steal the big blind, his profit will only be $1.

I thought the no flop/no drop rule was virtually universal. How common is it? Or do most cardrooms take a rake even if there's no flop?

As an aside, in places where they take a rake even on a no-flop hand, what if the blinds agree to chop? Do these rooms still take a rake then?

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually there are two different issues here.

First is no flop/no drop, but the second is the statement that a minimum of $1 will be taken.

If playing a $1 - $2 blind game and a player raises and succesully steals the blinds the pot size was in fact only $5. Taking $1 here would be a 20% rake (contradicting the other statement).

So if they really meant that a minimum of $1 will be taken you are correct, But if they really mean simply that there is no flop no drop then a blind steal would not be affected.

[/ QUOTE ]

There is actually only one issue here. They have never had this sort of poker int he past and they don't have an understanding of what differnt rules would mean to the players and don't fully understand the question.

[/ QUOTE ]

By "they," do you mean the Florida casinos, or the Florida poker players in general, or me in particular?

[psandman]

[ QUOTE ]
This is all background though. Do you have any insight into the main point of my post, which is to try to determine the universality (or lack thereof) of the no flop/no drop rule, which it seems the Seminoles have never heard of?

[/ QUOTE ]

In Vegas no Flop No Drop is the usual rule, but there are exceptions.

[chillrob]

I don't play much no limit, but in CA they generally take $1 out even if there is no flop, and even if the blinds chop. They take the dollar from the small blind - i.e. when I chop in the SB at the Bicycle Club 8/16 game, the big blind gets his $8 back, but I only get $3 (not $4) back. My guess is at the 1/2 no limit games there the SB wouldn't get anything back, but I'm not sure.

[FCBLComish]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't play much no limit, but in CA they generally take $1 out even if there is no flop, and even if the blinds chop. They take the dollar from the small blind - i.e. when I chop in the SB at the Bicycle Club 8/16 game, the big blind gets his $8 back, but I only get $3 (not $4) back. My guess is at the 1/2 no limit games there the SB wouldn't get anything back, but I'm not sure.

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I have seen the same thing. They take $1 from the small blind. It is so the casino does not lose money from a long string of blind steals.