NL25 Another wtf do i do hand with A10

hoyasnaxa · #1 06-27-2007, 09:20 PM

Villain just sat, so I assume he is an awful moron.

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (7 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

CO ($33.30)
Hero ($21.40)
SB ($9.50)
BB ($12.35)
UTG ($56.10)
MP1 ($9.15)
MP2 ($24.25)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
4 folds, Hero raises to $0.85, 1 fold, BB calls $0.60.

Flop: ($1.80) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $1.5, Hero raises to $3, BB calls $1.50.

Turn: ($7.80) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks.

River: ($7.80) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $8.5 (All-In), Hero calls $8.50.

Final Pot: $24.80

greggg230 · #2 06-27-2007, 09:24 PM

Folderoo time on the river. If he didnt have you beat on the flop, he does now.

+EV · #3 06-27-2007, 09:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Villain just sat, so I assume he is an awful moron.

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (7 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

CO ($33.30)
Hero ($21.40)
SB ($9.50)
BB ($12.35)
UTG ($56.10)
MP1 ($9.15)
MP2 ($24.25)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
4 folds, Hero raises to $0.85, 1 fold, BB calls $0.60.

Flop: ($1.80) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $1.5, Hero raises to $3, BB calls $1.50.

Turn: ($7.80) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks.

River: ($7.80) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $8.5 (All-In), Hero calls $8.50.

Final Pot: $24.80

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't like the min raise on the flop, or checking behind on the turn. That sets you up for having to call the river. Raise more on the flop and bet the turn. Maybe check behind on the river.

Greg

whyherro · #4 06-27-2007, 09:31 PM

anyone have a problem with just calling the flop bet.

Sean Fraley · #5 06-27-2007, 09:36 PM

It took me a while to learn this, but this line from villain means top pair is no good here.

Basically this is almost always a failed stack-a-donk attempt by a villain who hit two pair or a set on the flop, so he overbets the river assuming that if you had a hand you liked well enough to raise the flop with, you would like it well enough to call an overbet on the river with. Normally this would be 1.5x or 2x the pot on the river but villain didn't have enough chips and had to shove instead.

You will also see this line from a villain who bets his draw on the flop and was correct to call since your raise was to small to price out his OESD with 56. He plans to check-call the turn (so it's not so obvious that he was drawing to the straight) and pick up the turn bet he expects you to make. When you fail to bet, he overbets the river to try and make up for the money you failed to donate on the turn.

Sean Fraley · #6 06-27-2007, 09:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Villain just sat, so I assume he is an awful moron.

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (7 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

CO ($33.30)
Hero ($21.40)
SB ($9.50)
BB ($12.35)
UTG ($56.10)
MP1 ($9.15)
MP2 ($24.25)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
4 folds, Hero raises to $0.85, 1 fold, BB calls $0.60.

Flop: ($1.80) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $1.5, Hero raises to $3, BB calls $1.50.

Turn: ($7.80) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks.

River: ($7.80) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $8.5 (All-In), Hero calls $8.50.

Final Pot: $24.80

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't like the min raise on the flop, or checking behind on the turn. That sets you up for having to call the river. Raise more on the flop and bet the turn. Maybe check behind on the river.

Greg

[/ QUOTE ]

Hero doesn't have to call this bet. If villain had made a bet that of maybe 1/2 pot or less, than we would have to call but the overbet means that we are no good here. The turn check was a judgement call because we have to balance against charging the players who are calling with the OESD or FD vs. keeping the pot small if the draws come in and we lose the hand.

Sean Fraley · #7 06-27-2007, 09:43 PM

[ QUOTE ]
anyone have a problem with just calling the flop bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

On that wet of a board, yes I have a problem with it.

calmB4storm · #8 06-27-2007, 10:21 PM

*grunch*
I raise to $1.00 preflop, but that's really not important at all.
I think you have to raise more on the flop. He could be holding any ace, any lower pocket pair, flush draw, straight draw...plenty of value, so raise it to $4.50/$5.00.
As played I think you have to fold the river. I think he has us beat quite often, with anything from a slow-played straight to some sort of set/two pair/higher ace.

hoyasnaxa · #9 06-27-2007, 11:54 PM

thanks for the replies. just to let everyone know, i called river and he had QJ.

calmB4storm · #10 06-28-2007, 12:05 AM

[ QUOTE ]
thanks for the replies. just to let everyone know, i called river and he had QJ.

[/ QUOTE ]
he had what? [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]
nh! [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]