OT: Theory Question

[jhill3535]

I think the OP's point is that folding before the river gives up your equity in the pot. It doesn't have to be money that you have put in directly, but what you expect to get out of the pot on average. So folding anytime that you have the correct odds to continue is -EV as you are giving up your expectation out of what is in the pot.

[jimmytrick]

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I think the OP's point is that folding before the river gives up your equity in the pot. It doesn't have to be money that you have put in directly, but what you expect to get out of the pot on average. So folding anytime that you have the correct odds to continue is -EV as you are giving up your expectation out of what is in the pot.

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To solve an equation you simply zero out one side, we solve for EV the same way. Its just math.

[HAL PHIPA]

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(note mods this post should probably be in poker theory but I am a Full Ring player and am more familar with the posters in here so their opinions are more valuable to me. Move if you must though. thanks.

I was thinking about poker theory and I realized I may have believed a fallacy about it for a long time. Does a fold always have to be 0 ev in a no rake game? This is what was tought to me but seems to be wrong. IMO a fold has to the the mean of positive and negative EV. This way there is always atleast a 0 ev choice between bet, call, check, and fold, again assuming no rake. Is this right, wrong, or does it depened?

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It's entirely convention that folding is considered 0 EV. The idea behind EV in 2p2 terms is that you ignore everything that has gone on before. The money you put in the pot is no longer yours, but rather just a prize fund that all remaining players are aiming for.

Hence, if you fold you expect to win $0, and hence folding is always 0 EV. If calling/raising will win you more money than the ADDITIONAL amount you have to put in, these will be + EV.


It is perfectly acceptable however to look in terms of expected returns for the entire hand. Folding would then be a negative figure, being the amount you have already put in the pot. Calling and raising could be either positive or negative depending on the situation.


In either method, the best action is the one with the highest EV, i.e. your decisions would not change.


We choose the first method because it is easy to use in conversation - we can use the phrase "-ve play" to mean anything that is worse than folding, without having to work out the numbers exactly.

Your aim then is to never make a -ve EV play. If you learn how, tell me.

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This is a very good explanation. Also, make perfect reads and you will never make a -ve EV play (g).