NL200 Deep OOP against LAG.. HELP!

The Grumbler · #1 06-09-2007, 01:06 AM

Villain has been crazy up and down, running over table. Calls PF raises and 3bets light, but hasn't gone broke so he knows when to fold. We haven't tangled since my first hand when I 3bet him w/AK in the BB. I slowed down and let him hang himself, but he knew enough not to bet river after I called him on turn. No PT stats.

PF raise is to lose rock BB, LAG will surely call, but I'm ahead of his range.

Vill likes to steal on turn, hence CR. My image is somewhat weak tight... still learning deep stack play. $185 left to play for on river..

It looks like turn CR should be larger, but I never thought he would call it as this is the first time I'm playing back at him.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Hero ($540.35)
BB ($267.20)
UTG ($314.70)
MP ($172.70)
Button ($208)

Preflop: Hero is SB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls $2, 2 folds, Hero raises to $11, 1 fold, UTG calls $9.

Flop: ($24) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $17, UTG calls $17.

Turn: ($58) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets $36, Hero raises to $100, UTG calls $64.

River: ($258) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero ???

keikiwai · #2 06-09-2007, 03:10 AM

i think the turn cr is a mistake on this drawy board

shove river (edited: didn't see stack sizes left in relation to pot), he's not going to raise you with a flush since the board is paired, and he may call w/ worse kicker or other stuff

bet 130 or so

i just lead the turn again... why did you cr with such a drawy board? not only that, but a bet out keeps the pot smaller

too eazy · #3 06-09-2007, 03:25 AM

If you check raise that turn better be bigger than that...

carrotsnake · #4 06-09-2007, 03:27 AM

This is fine, now shove

DirteAA · #5 06-09-2007, 03:56 AM

I think a larger turn cr is needed here since villain was 150bb deep. I would have made it something like 136-155. I think it looks so much like a bluff that many players will call/shove there with a lot of hands you beat.

Based on the flop and turn action + your image I don't see what he would call the turn with that you beat on the river. If he also had a Q wouldn't he want to get it in on the turn? If he had AA or KK wouldn't he have raised the flop?

The pot is so big I don't see how you could c/f. I think you should expect to see a flush quite often though. I think his range is heavily weighted towards flush or boat, unless he is semi-retarded.

Kilillan · #6 06-09-2007, 04:34 AM

I think open shoving river is just terrible in many ways, but yeah if you're going to c/r turn then do it larger.

IF you simply potted turn and you can make a decision on the riv it would've made the hand easier to play

The Grumbler · #7 06-09-2007, 11:30 PM

When I CR the turn, it was to get more $ in the pot ON THE TURN, because I was sure he would bet if I checked and I was well ahead of his range. I was also quite sure that he would fold to my CR, as he'd folded every other time to aggression when he didn't have much. (That's why I didn't bother to properly size it.. I just put enough to make it reasonable, and leave less than PSB for river) Or he'd push. When he called, I didn't know what was up.

I took the worst route possible on the river. I bet about half of what was left, leaving no apparent fold equity. When he pushed over the top, I couldn't put him on a hand that I beat. But, 5:1 odds... he was definitely bluffing more than 1/6 of the time so I called.

He had 55 and MHIG.

Who played the river worse, villain or me?

RiverHebrew2 · #8 06-09-2007, 11:35 PM

I'm just going to say I love your line and your bet sizing is perfect. You played ur hand optimally. River is a good time to bet/fold $140 becuz he's not shoving worse on the river, so even though u'd be getting great odds to call a shove, it gives him no room to bluff the river IMO.