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#242
06-04-2007, 04:08 PM
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Re: Mr. Gatorade’s Lies cost me over 70k at Full Tilt
[ QUOTE ]
No they don't. It isn't a trial, you do not have the right to anything in these cases. You agreed to it all when you clicked the button agreeing to their terms and conditions. If you don't like the way they have handled this then don't play there. [/ QUOTE ] This portion of the T&C is almost certainly unenforceable as a matter of contract law*. These "clickwrap" provisions are almost always construed narrowly and against the drafter, especially where some kind of "penalty clause" (like the confiscation of 70k) is slipped in. * Assuming any portion of the T&C is enforceable - a court could rule that since the subject of the contract is illegal, the entire document is void. This would be, to put it mildly, a terrible result for all of us. 
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#243
06-04-2007, 04:15 PM
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Re: Mr. Gatorade’s Lies cost me over 70k at Full Tilt
[ QUOTE ]
I am glad StellarWind agrees with me that the OP may very well have a case of Libel if she/he is innocent. Either way if she gets Mr. Gatorade's info she can sue him in civil court whether she truely has a case or not. [/ QUOTE ] SW is correct that OP has a colorable cause of action for libel, and/or tortious interference (and possible harassment as well). The case would almost certainly turn on the truth or falsity of Gatorade's claims, (though there is some space for a finding that Gatorade was incorrect as to OP's botness but had a reasonable good faith belief that OP is a bot. Given the way this has played out, however, it's quite likely that Gatorade would be found to have been "recklessly indifferent" to the veracity of his accusations.) Please note, this is all hypothetical at this point, I'm not accusing Gatorade of anything but being an a-hole, which doesn't necessarily make him wrong.
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#244
06-04-2007, 04:15 PM
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Re: Mr. Gatorade’s Lies cost me over 70k at Full Tilt
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] beatme, what was your name on pokerroom? i used to play there 24/7. [/ QUOTE ] My nickname was redgar3. Please note that many players copied my nickname to try to prevent me from getting a game so there were lots of variations of this name used. If you were at the pokerroom wsop party last year you might have met me. I was a little tipsy and I kept telling people that I'm the real redgar. [/ QUOTE ] Do you have any comment to the results you get if you look you up at sharkscope? ROI: -97% on 67 tournaments at pokerroom.
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#245
06-04-2007, 04:30 PM
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Re: Mr. Gatorade’s Lies cost me over 70k at Full Tilt
[ QUOTE ]
Do you have any comment to the results you get if you look you up at sharkscope? ROI: -97% on 67 tournaments at pokerroom. [/ QUOTE ] Cash game only player that sometimes blows off steam / tilt-plays some tournies?
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#246
06-04-2007, 04:34 PM
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Re: Mr. Gatorade’s Lies cost me over 70k at Full Tilt
So bot makers can program bots that can beat great poker players HU. But they can´t program them to randomize how long their thinking process takes. Really really strange.
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#247
06-04-2007, 04:47 PM
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Re: Mr. Gatorade’s Lies cost me over 70k at Full Tilt
[ QUOTE ]
Audi, The reading comprehension in this forum is attrocious. How does "MrGatorade keeps saying that a few reputable 2+2ers have seen all of the evidence" = "Some 2+2er's know exactly what I know"???????????? Mr. Gatorade doesn't know everything Full Tilt knows and he'll be the first to admit that. What about that don't you understand? ___1___ [/ QUOTE ] You can nit-pick all you like. The pertinent facts are: 1. CrazyMike is 100% convinced he has evidence that BeatMe is a bot. 2. CrazyMike says that several 2+2ers know exactly what he does. 3. No other 2+2ers have come forward to support this claim as of yet.
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#248
06-04-2007, 04:49 PM
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Re: Mr. Gatorade’s Lies cost me over 70k at Full Tilt
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Well, the burden of proof is on you to prove that she never played against the bots. [/ QUOTE ] -Obv, your wrong. OP is making some sort of appeal for justice/sympathy for his/her situation, therefore burden of proof lies with OP. Full Tilt has already made their ruling, nobody responding to OP has to prove anything. [ QUOTE ] Also, <font color="red"> maybe I missed it </font> , I have yet to see anyone say that there were actually a significant number of "proven bots" playing at the same limits she was. [/ QUOTE ] Yup, you missed it. Scroll back. [/ QUOTE ] And what are you making an appeal to? Outright stupidity? How does your ability to cite textbook fallacies in many of her comments change anything? There has been no actual evidence presented that she has been running a bot. Her arguing skills are sub-par. Her general demeanor and ability to respond on point leaves something do be desired. But that doesn't mean she's wrong. She has appeared to have trouble answering some simple questions, but Mr. Gatorade is much more guilty of side-stepping simple questions and providing non-aswers than she is. She said she mostly opens tables and sits. Yes, it's highly suspicious if there is evidence that she has never played many "bots" which play her limits, but such evidence has not been presented, and even if it were, it would doubtless be incomplete. Even if there are good statistics out there they would have to go all the way back to the time at which she created her account for them to have much bearing given the explanations she has already provided. Multiple people in this thread have said she has sat with them and played them. That's a pretty big strike against the accusers. Sure, people can say "she plays ridiculous marathon sessions and sits at empty tables for hours," but is that true? Or is that just people speaking of what such a bot would behave like and assuming it is true? Do you think the fact that she doesn't use PT means anything? Most good players use PT, but I know extremely successful players who either do not use PT or use it only for tax purposes. Specifically, people who play HU or even 3 to 5-handed at the higest limits often find little use for it. Maybe there is evidence out there. Maybe she's running a bot. But that evidence certainly isn't in this thread. All I'm seeing is a lot of, "I have proof, but I won't say what it is." These statements are particularly suspicious when the "proof" that has been given is the farthest thing from incriminating. So explain yourself. How does the burden of proof lie on the OP? Would you like the bank to take your house then tell you that the burden of proof lies on you to prove that you paid your mortgage?
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#249
06-04-2007, 05:13 PM
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Re: Mr. Gatorade’s Lies cost me over 70k at Full Tilt
[ QUOTE ]
You can nit-pick all you like. The pertinent facts are: 1. CrazyMike is 100% convinced he has evidence that BeatMe is a bot. 2. CrazyMike says that several 2+2ers know exactly what he does. 3. No other 2+2ers have come forward to support this claim as of yet. [/ QUOTE ] Why do you care if anyone else comes forward to support his claims? The fact remains that FT obviously has information the neither Mike nor anyone else has. Mike just identified who he believed are bots, gave his information to FT, they investigated, and came to a conclusion. Until FT comes forward and says something publically (which hopefully they will)...what's the problem? ___1___
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#250
06-04-2007, 05:34 PM
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Re: Mr. Gatorade’s Lies cost me over 70k at Full Tilt
[ QUOTE ]
Sonneti, they may not have the same timing tells, but individual, unique timing tells. There are a number of reasons for these tells...without a delay then the bots would be quite obvious as they would be acting instantly each time, the bot software could be running on another computer linked to the playing computer causing a slight delay, or it could just be that the bot software is computation intense and just needs that time to make its decisions. [/ QUOTE ] And yet the "evidence" presented in Mr Gatorades original post was that they all shared the same timing tell.
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