NL200 - WOW i rly rly wanna fold flopped flush - is it possible? - Page 6

silenced · #51 06-02-2007, 05:35 AM

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silenced, nobody agrees with you

This is the most ridiculously +EV shove on the turn.

If he had the top of his range (higher flush), its a cooler.

You are really really digging

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Alright i guess ill end the discussion - I may be digging to deep in trying to narrow his range down to simply Adxx and higher flushes. But i rly rly think that you wil NEVER see any type of regular play a set like this in this situation. My reasoning for QQ+ (without a diamond) was that he would obviously bet/fold and with a diamond that he would bet/probably shove (but the point being that he would be betting not c/c). The only hands i see him c/c with here are truly higher flushes (because he is bad enough to slowplay them to oblivion), and Adxx from time to time. Regardless I knew i had to shove and did so to my dismay. Just wanted to bring up a discussion concerning the possible hand range from such an incredibly passive line on such a crazy board and multiway pot.

Bukem_ · #52 06-02-2007, 05:37 AM

I can't think of a single hand where i like his play. But if I were a bad player that slowplayed hands, I'd have the nuts here 100% of the time.

silenced · #53 06-02-2007, 05:39 AM

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I can't think of a single hand where i like his play. But if I were a bad player that slowplayed hands, I'd have the nuts here 100% of the time.

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ty

Klompy · #54 06-02-2007, 05:47 AM

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If you got coolered by a higher flush, learn that sometimes you make +EV plays and ppl have the exact top of their range. This is called a COOLER and it happens.

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I'm with OP, I haven't been in a situation like this where I've won the hand in over a month. Dear god I keep seeing monsters in the closet, but somehow they're always there because I always look them up.

by the way, obviously I don't actually agree with OP but I do know where his thinking can come from when every time you have a good hand you run into the nutz.

silenced · #55 06-02-2007, 05:50 AM

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[ QUOTE ]
If you got coolered by a higher flush, learn that sometimes you make +EV plays and ppl have the exact top of their range. This is called a COOLER and it happens.

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I'm with OP, I haven't been in a situation like this where I've won the hand in over a month. Dear god I keep seeing monsters in the closet, but somehow they're always there because I always look them up.

by the way, obviously I don't actually agree with OP but I do know where his thinking can come from when every time you have a good hand you run into the nutz.

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Ok umm, 1) I am not posting this as a result of getting railed by the nuts all the time, 2)I am not posting this because I actually think a fold is legitimate.

I posted this because I wanted to generate in depth discussion about his possible range of hands given the type of player he is, and the extremely passive line that he took.

FNG · #56 06-02-2007, 05:52 AM

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So the real range I see him on here is either higher flush or from time to time Adxx.

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Stove it, you're ahead of this range, too. But consider a weighted average. In this range, there's ~15 combinations you're behind, ~30 you're ahead of. You've got 85% equity vs. Adxx, 0 vs. a better flush. So he has to play a better flush this way about 5/3 as often as he plays Adxx this way for you to be a coinflip. With each of you having about the size of the pot left, he needs to play a made flush like this about 3 times more often than Adxx for a push to be 0EV. Assuming my top-of-the-head math is OK.

Still, this range is too narrow. There's certainly some nonzero chance he's got something like AdJx, 99, JJ, KdJx.

Klompy · #57 06-02-2007, 06:45 AM

silenced,
I wasn't trying to make fun of you in my post, I was only pointing out that it's really hard to think about normal ev when you're on a cooler. When you keep getting beat into the ground time after time with the nutz I can understand how it's possible to to see monsters everywhere.

edit: I'm a huge victim of this, I haven't had a winning day in 2 weeks [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

ElPhoenix · #58 06-02-2007, 07:49 AM

basically the only thing you need to think in this hand is "LOL acehole888" then you just LOLshove

rapidacid · #59 06-02-2007, 08:07 AM

FWIW, Acehole is 17/14 after 700 hands for me and he's at -19PTBB/100 ... WTSD is 29% and W$SD is 36% ... that's [censored] hard to do