2/4: 170bbs deep, 4-bet pot, TPTK... c/f?

[payoff wizard]

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this is the easiest shove ive ever seen

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OK champ, if this is the easiest shove you've ever seen (a $480 shove into a $456 pot, for the record), what hands have you got in villain's range that hero is beating with that flop?

[BalugaWhale]

c/c a shove

[AAismyfriend]

If you're going to c/f this board just fold preflop, you guys are a bunch of nits

[Yugless]

he 4bet pf to a sb squeeze, he has tptk and has enough for one psb, and he is checked to. you simply can never fold. you can never bet/fold obv, so any bet will be pot committing. also he's in position so i'm not sure where the c/f c/c talk comes from.

[xorbie]

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Xorbie is off..Im much closer with OP, I mean when we 4bet preflop how did we know he wouldn't fold fast. Now that we got here I'm betting...two Js are possible, so is AQs, and we chop with AK. We lose to AA/QQ (and the very rare KK).

Already putting in $210 I think our hand is good enough to put it in.

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so i'm off and yet you suggest sticking it in?

[xorbie]

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xorbie, think about what ur saying dude...

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if you think you are getting called by QQ+, AK then you are bluffing. and bluffing w/ AK 150bb deep is bad, because this is 2/4 and TAG guys aren't going to squeeze here against an UTG raiser and TWO guys who are both very deep without a pretty good hand or an occasional bluff.

[TheJared]

I think there are a ton of situations where I could see 4-betting preflop and then c/fing TPTK flops. If your opponent has a wide 3-betting range but rarely responds to your 4-bets is a good example.

At the same time the overall point Xorbie makes in this thread is good. DONT 4-bet here and not have a postflop plan! The OP doesnt really have any idea what this guys range is in a 4-bet pot and thus is in trouble.

I dont think sticking it in on the flop ever gets called by worse. I would check and see what he decided on the turn. If he checked again I would assume he didnt have anything on this board texture so I would definitely shove for value. A check behind here can induce action from a weaker hand and allow us to value bet him on later streets.

[TrickyDik]

Villain MUST think that flop hit you hard. If he bets, he's rarely bluffing.